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GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 6 Jul 2015 8:49PM GMT
Classification: Query
FOR MANY YEARS I UPDATED MY ONE ROOTSWEB TREE REGULARLY VIA GEDCOM FROM FAMILY TREE MAKER TO THE TREE MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES. THEN, LAST NOVEMBER I COULD NO LONGER DO SO. ROOTSWEB TECHS HAD NO SOLUTIONS AND AS I WANTED TO ADD AN EDITOR AT THAT TIME, I OPENED ANOTHER TREE ON ANCESTRY BUT HAD TO INDIVIDUALLY POST ALL THE NOTES AND PICTURES THERE, WE HAVE CONTINUED TO ADD NEW INFORMATION AND HAVE LEFT THE OLD ROOTSWEB TREE AS IT WAS BUT OPENED A SECOND ROOTSWEB TREE AS BACKUP FOR THE NEWANCESTRY TREE.

BOTH ANCESTRY AND ROOTSWEB TECHS TELL ME GEDCOMS WON'T MOVE PICTURES AND NOTES ALTHOUGH I DID SO FOR MANY YEARS. NOW I FIND THAT MY GEDCOMS FROM THE ANCESTRY TREE MOVES NOTE TITLES AND LINK TO NOTES AND PICTURES BUT NOT THE NOTES AND PICTURES THEMSELVES.

I ALSO FOUND A ROOTSWEB "ENGINEER" LAST DECEMBER WHO MADE A GEDCOM FROM THE OLD ROOTSWEB TREE AND UPLOADED IT TO A NEW ROOTSWEB TREE COMPLETE WITH NOTES AND PICTURES SHOWING NOTES AND PICTURES CAN TRAVEL VIA GEDCOM. UNFORTUNATELY FOLLOWING THE INSTRUCTIONS HE GAVE ME HASN'T WORKED FOR ME AND I'VE BEEN UNABLE TO CONTACT HIM AGAIN.

CAN ANYONE TELL ME HOW TO MOVE PICTURES AND NOTES FROM MY ANCESTRY TREE TO MY ROOTSWEB BACK UP TREE COMPLETE WITH NOTES AND PICTURES AS I DID FOR SO MANY YEARS ON ROOTSWEB?


CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN TO ME WHAT IS GOING ON?

I CAN PROVIDE LINKS TO ALL THESE TREES

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 6 Jul 2015 11:53PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 6 Jul 2015 11:58PM GMT
GEDCOM does not move pictures, never has, never will.

What a GEDCOM can do is move the link of the location of the picture on your hard drive from one product to another. If the location of the picture is not on your hard drive or the location path in the GEDCOM is incomplete then the path will never work and the reading program will not find the picture.

As far as NOTEs, it kind of depends on what kind of NOTE it is and how each of the products support NOTEs.

Since most programs don't support GEDCOM correctly, data is always lost. if each of the program's create the same type of NOTE data they should be read by the other.

So the problem could be several different things depending on what each program can generate and what they expect and read. Just because they once worked does not mean they will now work if you have loaded updates of either program. Software companies occasionally break their code or remove features.

Also check to see if the programs have any parameters to their export and import processes you may need to experiment with the options to create something that increases compatability.

Sorry to say that while some people will say that GEDCOM is old wHich in this case is not true, BUT rather it is usually the fault of the programs not creating good GEDCOM or not reading GEDCOM correctly.

I don't use ACOM (ancestry.com) or Rootsweb because they don't support GEDCOM correctly and my database is GEDCOM compliant.

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 8 Jul 2015 7:16AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hello kj_norway,

Thank you for your informative response to my posting.

Over the years, I have received much new information, corrections and other help from searchers who happened upon our family trees and what I'm trying to do now is post a copy including, if not the pictures, at least the informative notes and relationships shown on my Ancestry tree at:

http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/63977057/recent

on some site that might best give me more such help.

This Ancestry tree is the tree we're adding to now and so might be the tree most helpful to others and, if those other searchers contact us at pusch@comcast.net, with additions or corrections and open a dialog, be potentially very helpful to both them and to us.

If Gedcoms posted to a backup tree on RootsWeb can’t do it, because the notes with much of our information are missing, what do you suggest we do?

How would you post as complete a copy of the Ancestry tree as possible, where the most potential readers would see it, and what method would you use to get it there and keep it updated?

I appreciate your help so far and look forward to your reply.

Bruce

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 8 Jul 2015 1:04PM GMT
Classification: Query
You could look into hosting your own website using output from your software. Some desktop programs can generate HTML. You may have to do some manual updating of the HTML to setup the pictures and correct errant links. Many years ago I did this using PAF. I've also seen GEDCOM to HTML programs on the web. Wrote some code for myself several years ago as well.

Or you could invest a little more time and money to look into hosting your own site using GEDCOM compliant software like webtrees. This is a fully interactive program that allows your users to actually update data themselves. The software is free but requires a little more expensive web hosting environment and some web site creation/background on your part.

Some of the developers offer to run the software on their own equipment for you, at additional cost. I have no connection with these offerings or get any kickbacks from them, but I've known them for several years.

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 8 Jul 2015 5:38PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi again kj_norway,

Thank you for your quick and informative response.

On the idea of hosting my own website, wouldn’t the only way for a genealogical searcher to find me then be through Google or some other search engine? I would think if I were already on a site frequented by many genealogical searchers, I would have a better chance of making contact with those who can correct or add to what I already have such has been my experience for so many years on RootsWeb.

Do you think as many of these “helpers” I seek would find me and contact me if I were alone on my own site?

My basic problem in following your other advice is that although I have used desktop computers for perhaps 25 years, I am basically a computer illiterate when it comes to performing the tasks you suggest. I am an 87 year old man with failing eyesight and an old desktop computer and would have no idea on how to, or even how to find out how to, take the actions you suggest.

Do you know of an existing site, RootsWeb or something like it, and software I could purchase, that would allow me to put up a tree there showing all the information I now show on my Ancestry.com tree?

I had email contact with a RootsWeb engineer last December who put up a copy of my old RootsWeb tree, the one I updated complete with new notes and pictures for so many years, and gave me instructions on how I might do the same.

Unfortunately, on the advice of another RoostWeb tech, I moved the dree I work on to Ancestry so rather than moving information between two RootsWeb trees, I now have to move it from an Ancestry tree to a RootsWeb tree and have never been able to do as he did and I can no longer reach him to find out why I’m unsuccessful or to get additional instructions.

But the old original RootsWeb tree he copied is at

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&d...

(As you can see it has over 600,000 hits in just the few years since I put up the counter and so has produced many helpers for me)

The new RootsWeb tree the Engineer put up in December, a copy of the old RootsWeb tree above, complete with notes and pictures, is at

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&d...

The instructions the RootsWeb engineer gave me so I could supposedly also do what he had successfully done are:

THE ROOTSWEB ENGINEER’S INSTRUCTIONS, IN AN EMAIL TO ME, WERE AS FOLLOWS:: (HIS INSTRUCTIONS ARE IN LOWER CASE AND NUMBERED AND MY COMMENTS, AS I TRIED TO FOLLOW THESE INSTRUCTIONS, ARE IN CAPITAL LETTERS AND PARENTHESIS).

HERE’S HIS EMAIL:

From: (Not having his permission, I have deleted his address)
To: pusch@comcast.net
Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2014 4:40:51 PM
Subject: Re: Worldconnect Tree

HERE ARE THE ROOTSWEB ENGINEER’S INSTRUCTIONS:

(I HAVE TRIED THIS MANY TIMES WITHOUT SUCCESS AND MY COMMENTS AS I DID THIS THE LAST TIME ARE IN CAPITAL LETTERS AND PARENTHESIS…THE ENGINEER STARTS:).

1. go to http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/wcus

2. pick the tree you would like to change

(FOR THE ANCESTRY TREE WHICH IS THE ONE I WANT TO COPY, I GO TO

http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/63977057/settings/info

( AND CLICK ON TREE SETTINGS)

(TO COPY AN OLD ROOTSWEB TREE AS THE ENGINEER DID go to

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/wcus (THIS LINK ABOVE IS THE LINK THE ROOTSWEB ENGINEER USED IN HIS # 1. INSTRUCTION ABOVE AND TAKES YOU TO THE ROOTSWEB TREE “ADMINISTRATION PAGE” AND I CLICKED ON pusch test WHICH IS THE ROOTSWEB TREE I USE NOW FOR ANCESTRY TREE BACKUPS SO IS NOW THE RECIPIENT OF THE ANCESTRY TREE GEDCOMS. I’M NOT SURE IF ONE TREE, BOTH TREES OR THE GEDCOM THAT CARRIES THE INFORMATION BETWEEN THEM HAS TO BE SOMEHOW CHANGEED SO THE BACKUP TREE WILL DISPLAY NOTES AND PICTURES)

3 on the right hand side click on display options.

(FOR THE ANCESTRY TREE THERE ARE NO DISPLAY OPTIONS TO CLICK SO I JUST DID THE ONLY THING I COULD SEE AVAILABLE TO ME AND JUST DOWNLOADED A GEDCOM TITLED “LATEST 7-7-15 BRUCE COOLEY PUSCH TREE (3)” AND TRIED TO FOLLOW THE ENGINEER’S INSTRUCTIONS ON THE ROOTSWEB (RECIPIENT) TREE BEFORE I UPLOADED THIS NEW GEDCOM THERE)

(THE ROOTSWEB TREE THE DISPLAY OPTIONS THE ROOTSWEB ENGINEER SPOKE OF ARE AT:

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/wcus?db=bcpusch (WHICH IS THE pusch
test TREE),

4.Near the bottom on that page looks for
Allow HTML in GEDCOM and select yes. Click Update at the bottom

(YOU FIRST HAVE TO CLICK “DISPLAY OPTIONS” THEN FROM THAT LIST CLICK “ALLOW HTML” AND THEN CLICK “UPDATE.” AND I GOT DISPLAY OPTIONS UPDATED BACK SO THE ROOTSWEB TREE SEEM READY TO ACCEPT HTML IF IT’S ON THE ANCESTRY TREE GEDCOM)

5. Click take tree offline (I DID THIS}

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/wcus?db=bcpusch&...

6. Then click proceed button. (I DID THIS)

7. click Put tree online (I WAITED JUST A FEW MINUTES AND DID THIS AND GOT THE MESSAGE “Database puschtest will be publicly viewable on WorldConnect in a few minutes but may not appear in search results for 36 hours.”)

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/wcus?db=bcpusch&...

8. Wait a few minutes and it should be fixed.

(I WAITED “ A FEW MINUTES” BUT NO NOTES AND PICTURES WERE TRANSFERRED. I FOUND AND OPENED THE HOPEFULLY UPDATE AND COMPLETE WITH NOTES AND PICTURES ROOTSWEB TREE BOOKMARK AND IT WAS UPDATED BUT STILL WITHOUT NEW NOTES AND PICTURES SO I CHECKED AGAIN IN 36 HOURS AND THERE WERE NO PICTURES AND A NEW NOTE TITLE HAD TRANSFERRED BUT NOT THE NOTE ITSELF).


(THE ENGINEER’S SIGNED NAME IS DELETED HERE AT THE END FOR I DO NOT HAVE HIS PERMISSION TO USE IT. I’VE TRIED TO REACH HIM MANY TIMES TO FIND OUT WHAT I’M DOING WRONG BUT AM NOW UNABLE TO REACH HIM).

Is there any way you can tell me how to duplicate what this RootsWeb engineer did so that it can be done by me every month or so with a Gedcom or some other software I can buy, to copy the Ancestry tree at http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/63977057/recent and then use that Gedcom or whatever the name is of the result from other software I can purchase, to update a tree on RootsWeb, or some other such site, perhaps even to update my present RootsWeb backup tree at http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-in/igm.cgi?db=puschtest ?

I understand this is very confusing but I’ve made it as clear as I seem to be able to and I hope it give you enough information to answer at least one of the following two questions :

1. Do the RootsWeb Engineers instructions give you any clue as to how I might use them to regularly copy the Ancestry tree, complete with notes and pictures, to the RootsWeb back up tree as the Engineer successfully used them to copy from an old RootsWeb tree to a new RootsWeb tree?

2. If the Engineer’s instructions are of no help to me in doing what I want to do, do you have any suggestions on how I might find an existing site, RootsWeb or something like it, and software I could purchase, that would allow me to put up a backup tree, somewhere, showing all the information now on my Ancestry.com tree?

I appreciate your help so far and have high hopes you can point me in the right direction now.
Bruce

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 8 Jul 2015 7:31PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 8 Jul 2015 9:36PM GMT
Far too much to read today.

Having your own site does require people to search for you via a web search engine. But that is not big deal for people who are looking to add to your family if you provide good meta data for the search engine. Meta data is what puts your site on the first page of the result list.

For the most part Ancestry and RootsWeb try to lock you into their site and not let you go. This is one of the downside to them not supporting GEDCOM correctly, they make it hard for people to get out. However if you can live with these restrictions, limitations and "gotch-as" they are pretty much the only games in town.

I always, regardless of the software used, tell people at the genealogy center where I volunteer, pick a program (one program) and use it. Learn as much as you can about how to make it work, find out all the workarounds that make it do what you want within the bounds of the software you can from other users. Every program has limitations and requires work-arounds, even the program I use does not have every feature I would like to use, but it gives me the best control over every other program I have used.

DO NOT EXPECT to be able to transfer data between programs without loss, so pick one and tell everyone you can to use that environment.

Obviously I am a little sour on ACOM because they are well noted by users to have issues with the way they store and what they store on their system. The data kept is not very robust and not easy to offload to other programs, but they have a direct connection to the sources kept on ACOM and that is very helpful to genealogist that would rather have the software do the recording rather than being their own librarian.

I'll continue to read your message above to see what other questions you have. I'll be happy to answer them as time permits. I don't use either ACOM or RootsWeb at this time, I tried them but found them lacking in reports, following librarian practices, open structure and interface, GEDCOM standard adherence, and other stuff that I could not live without.

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 8 Jul 2015 8:26PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi again,

I realize my last posting was very long and involved and I apologize for it.

I do appreciate your reading at least part of it , promising to read the rest later and then posting your partial answer and telling me so.

I my two questions are at the very end of that long posting which was my attempt to tell you what I feel I need, what I've tried already and what I hope you can help me find.

It/s interesting that you volunteer to help people with genealogy. I volunteer too in the Health Center where I live here in Delray Beach. Florida.

I hope to hear from you one day again soon.

Thank you for all you've already told me.

Bruce

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 9 Jul 2015 2:38PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 9 Jul 2015 4:38PM GMT
I can't get into any of the URL links you provided. Maybe because you have security turned on, but also for RootsWeb I must be a member and at this time I am not a member.

I note that your instructions include talk about HTML. Strictly speaking HTML should not be part of a GEDCOM, but the issue here is where does the HTML point and do you need to provide some password to get at the site noted in the GEDCOM?

Anyway....

I may have missed in the instructions where/when you save the GEDCOM output from ACOM. If I missed this SORRY for not reading well. But, if you are loading to your computer from ACOM a GEDCOM file I would love to see a snippet of the file to see what they produce for the NOTEs and OBJE (picture) values.

NOTEs can come in two forms, a note about a person would look like this in the GEDCOM:

1)

0 @I2@ INDI
1 NAME Mary Ann /Wilson/
1 SEX F
1 BIRT
2 DATE BEF 1828
2 PLAC Connecticut
1 FAMS @F4@
1 NOTE @N3@ <= Here is the Note as a pointer to a NOTE record

0 @N3@ NOTE
1 CONT text of note
1 CONT text of note

2)
0 @I2@ INDI
1 NAME Mary Ann /Wilson/
1 SEX F
1 BIRT
2 DATE BEF 1828
2 PLAC Connecticut
1 FAMS @F4@
1 NOTE
2 CONT text of note
2 CONT text of note

Either version is correct but both projects/programs need to understand the other or the NOTE will be lost.

You can look at these yourself by opening the GEDCOM output from ACOM before you load the file to RootsWeb.

I'll add more about pictures later, they are much more complicated and from GEDCOM standpoint.

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 9 Jul 2015 5:25PM GMT
Classification: Query
A Note associated with an event would be similar and look like this:

0 @2@ INDI
1 NAME Mary Ann/Wilson/
1 SEX F
1 BIRT
2 DATE BEF 1828
2 PLAC Connecticut
2 NOTE @N3@ <= Here is the Note as a pointer to a NOTE record
1 FAMS @4@

A picture of a person would look like this:

0 @I2@ INDI
1 NAME Mary Ann /Wilson/
1 SEX F
1 BIRT
2 DATE BEF 1828
2 PLAC Connecticut
1 FAMS @F4@
1 OBJE @M3@ <= Here is the Picture as a pointer to a OBJEct record (also call a media record)

0 @M3@ OBJE
1 FILE c:\\..........

Re: GEDCOMS NOW NOT MOVING PICTURES AND NOTES

Posted: 9 Jul 2015 6:42PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi again kj_norway,

Thank you for your continuing efforts to help me.

Am I correct in understanding that none of the four links I gave you to the three RootsWeb and one Ancestry tree would work for you?

I’ve sent these links to many people over the years and I thought at least the RootsWeb links I sent always worked.

On the new Ancestry tree however, I now remember you may need to be a member of Ancestry or I have to invite you in using their instructions at

http://help.ancestry.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/493/kw/how%...

for you to view that tree. If you wish to see that Ancestry tree, please give me your name and email address and I’ll send you an invitation.

The Ancestry tree shows the pictures and notes not on the open page like they are on the RootsWeb trees so I suppose that separation may shield them from being copied and used to update a RootsWeb, or maybe any other, tree.

As for the the three RootsWeb trees, which I had thought were always open to all, at least the original old one can be accessed through typing in my name, Bruce Cooley Pusch into Google and at least the old one is listed at the top under RootsWeb's WorldConnect Project: Bruce Cooley...clicking on that should bring you to the old RootsWeb tree with the address http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&d... that you said wouldn’t work for you.

That would give you two of the trees and if you wish to also see the other two, I would have to check with a RootsWeb tech to see how to do it.

If you can tell me which trees you wish to see, I’ll try to get it done. The one tree you can easily see now, the Old RootsWeb tree, has the notes and pictures just the way I would like them to appear and I was able to work with it and update it for many years until last November when suddenly the pictures would no longer travel. With the RootsWeb trees, unlike the Ancestry tree, I was unable to work directly on the tree and worked in Family Tree Maker 2012 and then updated that to the tree. Whether that update traveled by Gedcom or some other means I don’t know but suddenly it no longer worked.

That’s when I was advised by a RootsWeb tech to open an Ancestry tree and buy Family Tree Maker 2014. After I was on the Ancestry tree, and making additions, I found I could do them right on the tree and so have not been using Family Tree Maker 2014.

At least I thought I wasn’t now using Family Tree Maker.

Now when you talk of wanting to see the Gedcom I created on the Anecstry tree to update the new RootsWeb backup tree (I now find I can’t so easily show you), I just tried opening what I thought was the Gedcom I just created on 7/7/15 and just used and instead of opening into a file showing Gedcom text like you showed in your last message, it opened into what is apparently a copy of Family Tree Maker 2011 (not the 2012 I used to successfully used to use on RootsWeb nor the 2014 I now have, but don’t use for Ancestry).

On7/7/15, I thought, and the instructions said I was, downloading a Gedom by following the Ancestry instructions that are titled ”Downloading a GEDCOM file from Ancestry” which are at
http://help.ancestry.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/472/kw/HOW%....

This whole thing is getting more confusing every day.

If you can tell me which of the non-working links in my previous messages to you to work on, I’ll do what I can to get you there.

Google will get you to the old RootsWeb tree and if you send me your name and email address, I’ll see how to get you an invitation to visit my Ancestry tree and Icould try to attach that Family Tree Maker 2011 file I created on 7/7/15 and that their instructions call a Gedcom, and anything else you think might help, to an email to you.

I sure appreciate your patience with all this and hope you will stick with me long enough to point me in the right direction.

I sure would like to be able to display a complete updated tree, like the old Rootweb tree used to be, to the general public again and it sure looks like we’re not doing showing much open to the public now.

No wonder we’re no longer getting as many emails from “helpers” as we used to.

I think I've unloaded enough on you here, but as you volunteer as a genealogical helper, one other thing has always bothered me. When you Google and see my old RootsWeb tree, you'll see I have been successful in finding many, many of my Mother's ancestors but can only trace back to the two grandfathers and greand mothers on my father's side. They were all born in Germany and I once got birth reconds from Germany for them through an LDS genealogical help group near here but the records were hand written in German and I was unable to find anything in them. Do you have any search ideas that might help me trace at least one of these four individuals further back?

Thanks again. I sure look forward to your next reply.

Bruce
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