Are we all descended from kings?
When I proudly told a friend that I was descended from kings, he said that he thought we probably all were if only we could go back that far. It set me wondering about probabilities.
If I go back 7 generations, I can identify about 40 of the 128 ancestors. If I go back 24 generations, I can only identify one of the 17 million (2**24) odd ancestors. So far all my ancestors are solidly working class, but this ancestor, Margaret Fitzgerald, opens up a world of royal connections. Among her descendants are: Malcolm II of Scotland, Rhodri Mawr of Gwynedd, Alfred the Great, Brian Boru, Charlemagne and King Beringer of Italy. But, take Charlemagne, for example b c742. This is about 50 generations back, so theoretically I have 2**50 or 1000 million million ancestors. I suppose that from this many possibilities it is not surprising that a few of them are royal. Was my friend right when he said that we're all descended from kings?
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
You are forgetting pedigree collapse so you really don't have that many ancestors.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
Your friend is probably right. And you don't have 17 million ancestors 24 generations back. There would be many duplicates, a serious case of "pedigree collapse." One of the common sayings in genealogy is that if you have western European ancestry you are guaranteed to be descended from Charlemagne, and probably from every one of his children who left descendants. Its been said that every Scot is a descendant of King David I and every middle class Englishman is a descendant of Edward III. Of course both kings have numerous descents from Charlemagne--and Alfred the Great. The problem is proving the descent. You were able to (provided the proof holds up). I don't know how true it is but I also heard that everybody living today is descendant from everybody who was living in 1100 and who left descendants. And that everybody living in 1100 was descendant from everybody living in AD 1 who left descendants.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
Thanks for your interesting and informative reply. Yes, I had forgotten about all the duplicates. I found numerous second cousins and even some first cousins.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
I should correct my reply. The article I read that indicated that everybody alive today descends from everybody alive who left descendants did NOT mention the year 1100. It's more recent. Everybody alive today descend from everybody who left descendants who were alive in 1300 (probably some point between 1300 and 1400).
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
The 1300 - 1400 period is likely correct since the Black Death (The Plague) between about 1340 and 1400 killed from 30% to 60% of the population in Europe. Those of us alive today would have to mostly be descendants of the ones who survived the Plague and hence most of us come from the few people left about 1400.
The Royalty and Nobility were also more likely to have survived due to better living conditions (fewer fleas in their beds, etc.) and also better records kept of their family lines than those of the poorer classes. That means if we are able to trace our lineage back to those times we are most likely to find someone of "importance" even though we may also descend from lesser folk too whose records have not survived or were never recorded.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
I've been wondering the same thing. I'm pretty sure I can trace my roots back to King Henry the IV which sounds pretty cool to me. But I'm guessing thats not really all that unique.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
I'd say it's quite likely we all are. I don't recall the actual number's but it's very possible. You can look it up I'm sure. I did a few years ago. Still cool though. Lots of work proving it though. But worth it in my opinion. "They say" vs "I know it is" sort of thing. Not to impress since most people do a "Uh huh right sure you are, let me guess you saw it on a tree and didn't check, etc etc.. or it's, "ok, so your point is?". The point is the same one looking for a dirt famer is.....yours. Family. Great umpteen grandfather or Grandmother. King or commoner. Yours and worth knowing about. Do it for you not for the rest of the world. It's odd but mention a King and you get flak, mention a dirt farmer and you get listened to.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
True. The thing is that even if we all are descended from kings and nobility most people can't find that "gateway ancestor " that will take you back ( read that somewhere ). However, if you do find them it opens you up to some very well documented ancestry. And of course when you start going that far back nobility and royalty are usually ( with some exceptions I'm sure), the only well documented families. So if your going to be able to trace your family that far back it's going to be through one of those people.
|
Re: Are we all descended from kings?
BTW I think it's still a theory. Partly based on how people spread out as the years go on. But also because the genealogist who had the idea said that the only trees he could ever find that went very far back always wound up having a royal connection. So he started to think this was the rule not the exception. Of course it could also be because those are the only families documented. Another idea I heard was that during the plague ( one of several outbreaks ) there was a massive loss of population, and that most of the people that survived were family of nobility. So those were the ones whose blood lines lived on.
Perhaps DNA can shed some light.
|