Huguenots-Walloons-Europe - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Re: The Society of Saint Onge (1800s-1900s London, ENG)

ariley61 — 2009-12-29 20:14:13Z

Dear Deborah

In reply to your posting of 22 May 2009. My apologies for not responding sooner.
I have the following family tree leading to Charlotte Scott nee Pottier:
Jean Pottier b 1631 m 1653 Jeanne Delahage
son Jean Pottier b 1655 m 1683 Marthe le Marie
son Jean Pottier b 1684 m 1705 Anne Tocqueville
son Guillaume Pottier b 1719 m Elizabeth Le Vaseur
son Jacques Pottier bapt 1750 m Anne Dorothea Munday
son George Louis Pottier bapt 1775 m Marie Anne Pige
daughter Charlotte Pottier bapt 1808 m John Scott 1830

Charlotte died in the French hospital 28 June 1898
Children: Henry, Robert,John, Ann, James , Edwin.

Robert m Annie Scott (cousin)
Children: Will, Robert,Florence,Annie,Elizabeth, Rose (my grandmother m Horace Riley)

John b 1832 ( apprenticed by Society of Saint Onge) m Eleanor Bishop

I hope this is of interest

Alan Riley

Re: The Society of Saint Onge (1800s-1900s London, ENG)

ariley61 — 2009-12-29 19:33:32Z

Dear Debra

In reply to your posting re the Society of St Onge on 31 July. Apologies for not replying sooner, but I did some research about 5 years ago, but have not followed it up recently.

My grandmother's apprenticeship was funded by the Socety of St Onge from the bequest of Mrs Margaret Mary Delaigle. The indenture document was dated 1905 and 1906 and was printed by Grellier and Son 211 Grays Inn Road. It is signed by Mr J G Grellier. In 1905 Mr J G Grellier was Secretary of the society and Mr CW Heraud was treasurer.

Sometime around 1970 I wrote to Mr C F Grellier in Devon who was then secretary of the society, although at that time I did not pursue matters futher (I think I was after a grant for my studies!)

In 2005 I wrote to Mr Christopher G Grellier in Somerset. He wrote to me in March 2005, saying that to his knowledge, hs branch f the Grellier family never had any connection with the Society of Saint Onge.

I hope that this is of interest

Alan Riley

Re: Henri Cabanis - Where and when??

Pamela_Binion — 2009-12-28 19:31:58Z

Thank you so much for this information. I did not have any of it, so it helps tremendously.

Re: Henri Cabanis - Where and when??

patperkins264 — 2009-12-28 16:57:27Z

Joab Caviness is the son of Richard Caviness.He is one of the children found with Richard on the census for 1800 Chatham Co .Little is known of Richard he shows up on the 1800 census for Chatham Co NC.He arrived there with other Caviness about 1799.It is presumed he is closely related to the others Matthew,and Fredrick.who arrived at about the same time and were of the same basic generation.It is presumed he is a brother to Matthew and Fredrick.Since this is what tradition also has been.The area Richard lived in is very near the Randolph Co line .Joab (going by memory here)married Elizabeth Mann,the daughter of Isham Mann.This family lived near Richard.Richard contrary to what some genealogies reported,had the following children Mary (Polly) about 1783 (under 20)William born about 1786,John,about 1788 Joab,(under10)or about 1795 and Lacretia,(under 10) .This family is a little confusing because Later Mary (Polly)had a son Kirby and three daughters who are found periodically in Richards home.I believe that the 1800 census does a great job of outlining Richards true family because it shows only Richards family Later census look like Mary or Pollys children are there,at least part of the time.Tradition states that Kirby was Marys child raised by Richard,and that there were some daughters.William the oldest son married Mary Vestal.their sons settled either in Morgan Co Indiana( along with Kirby,and Lacretia,(married a Bradley)others siblings went to Lamar Co Tx.This family has been royally messed up by different genealogical books particularly in regards to the parents of William(married Mary Vestal).Tradition says he was Richards,he is on the census with Richard,his sons migrated with other of Richards family.This book placed him in the family of Matthew who is reportedly Richards brother.When all of the Caviness migrated to the area of Randolph and Chatham Co NC from Va and Granville Co NC.They apparently came as a group.In that group is a young widow named Sarah Caviness.It is theorized without proof ,but is as likely as any scenario,that she had been married to a William who was the son of Matthew.Sarah died in 1803,and two local men William Carr,and Rolly Spinks were appointed as guardians of her estate,there were four children named in court papers naming her four children and giving their ages and dates of birth,The oldest was a Benjamin he was 15 the youngest Polly age 9,These four children were bound out after her death two going to Fredrick and one to Matthews , and one to a local family named Craven.When the Caviness book was first printed the claim in there was that William Carr must have been the young widows brother,and that he along with Polly the widows oldest daughter were co executors.At that time the author felt that Richards Polly was the daughter of this Sarah.Where she arrived at the conclusion that she was a co executor was beyond me .Then after the book was Published it was found the true names and ages of the children,and this particular Polly was only 9 and obviously not a co executor.The author should have realized also because there are found in the book where these four children as adults sign off on the sale of some of Sarahs land ,and only four names are found there.So it should be obvious that there were only these four children in this family.Still most people who descend from William the oldest son of Richard continue to think that their ancestor is William who is the son of Matthew and this young widow Sarah.The second most preposterous claim is that because local man William Carr was appointed as one of the executors he must be Sarahs brother. The author again did not take into consideration that this man had lived in the Randolph Co area for at least 20 years, and Sarah had just recently arrived,with these four pre teen children.Plus the Sarah who was Williamm Carrs sister married the notoriuos Tory David Fanning,her story is well written in David Fannings autobiography.The next conclusion that the author jumps to is that Fredricks wife must also be related and is a sister to Sarah and William Carr.Again Fredrick and his wife married long before migrating to the area where the Carrs lived in Randolph Co NC.There also was no Elizabeth in this family.Most people who document their families who descend from either Richards William,or Fredricks family put this bogus Carr information down as fact.Just the fact that Fredrick and his wife took in two of the children of the widow Sarah when she died is no evidence of them being sisters.anymore likely than saying the Craven family mother must be her sister,or Matthews wife must be this sarahs sister.It is just not remotely likely that Fredrick and Richard living in the area of Mecklenburg Co Va would have met and married sisters living in Randolph Co NC.20 years before migrating there.One needs to look to the area of Mecklenburg Co vA and Granville Co NC(just across the co line )In fact Matthew had land in both states and it was connected.This is the area their wives would have come from.

Re: De La Garde Huguenot ?

paulaR066 — 2009-12-28 05:31:30Z

Hi,

My GGG Grandfather is also John De la Garde- married Ann Morton. His son, William, had a daughter, Victoria Alice, who is my grandmother's mother.

I was wondering, did you ever find out any more about the family's origins?
Cheers
Paula

Re: DELACHAUX, etc: 1650s Vaud, Switzerland > 1740s London, ENG

lachaux1 — 2009-12-19 22:27:02Z

I am a doing research on my family history and I would like to share what I've found.

COSTE in South Carolina - Earlier citations

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-24 22:33:33Z

It's always interesting to find an earlier citation of a surname under investigation and then research it to prov or disprove any relevance. There are indications for Isaac Coste in SC dated 1743 and before 1765. Search with the two words: Coste Purrysburgh.

There is also another JSTOR article titled "Purrysburgh", so you're double or nothing on access there. If one takes the hint and runs like crazy, some speculation might arise that Coste has a Swiss origin, but Huguenot possibilities are not eliminated as some French exiles did settle in parts of Switzerland. Lots of speculation and not enough parchment under the fingernails.

Regards,
KA

Re: Rev. John Paul Coste

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-23 22:30:03Z

I wouldn't exactly say that listings for Jean Coste are a dime a dozen, but you can't just stick a pin in one and say that's it. Montpellier was in Languedoc, so Bordeaux is contradictory. It's going to be tough. Herault is well represented in the data that LDS has transcribed to its internet archives. Other locations - not so much.

JSTOR just puts up the first page. You should look for a library that subscribes to their service.

Regards,
KA

Re: Rev. John Paul Coste

caustin151 — 2009-11-23 21:36:33Z

Thank you so very much for your reply. I just srarted this search when I retired 5 months ago, so I am new to genealogy. I have contacted the Charleston Hugunot society. He was pastor at that church 1791-95. He was also a professor at the Collage of Charleston during that time. They directed me to the 1790 Census of S.C. Jean Paul Costa. He petitioned for naturalization 7 Jan. 1790 stating that he had been a resident of Charleston for 12 months. He was "one of the most militant club members" of the Jacobin club 1792-95.
I did find a Jean Coste born in Gignac, Herault, France on Feb 29 1754 through Family Search.org. but am not sure if that is him or not. According to a cousin- according to the Georgia Gazett dated Feb 19, 1789, he arrived in the U.S.-Georgia Feb 1789 from Bordearx.
I will check RootsWeb. How would I find the Jstor article that you refered to?

Re: Rev. John Paul Coste

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-23 20:48:45Z

Beyond the proverbial passage in Howe (1860) p. 570 and his officiating at a couple of weddings, there doesn’t seem to be much else available on the Rev J. P. Coste. However his dates of service in Charleston (1791-95) are rather late for a direct emigrant of the 1685 exodus or the Camisard revolt c. 1700. Was he actually born in France, or did his parents come from Montpellier, and when was he born?

With nothing yet outside these dates of service to indicate where he was living, there is something to be mentioned within these dates as they fit so closely with those of the JSTOR article titled “A French Jacobin Club in Charleston, South Carolina, 1792-1795”, which then comes to the time of the French revolution.

The surname COSTE is not uncommon and has several different lines among the Huguenots. Coste from Montpellier can be found in the RootsWeb freepages database: French Refugees in Great Britain in the early 1700s. Also RootsWeb has two listings for Coste in South Carolina, b. 1800 +/- 20. Not to say that any of this strings together.

He does not appear in the National Huguenot society list of validated American Huguenots, so there are problems somewhere. There appears to be no previous inquiry regarding him here or in the now defunct American oriented archives. It may be necessary to contact the Huguenot society in Charleston or seek the assistance of other Charleston researchers in the attempt to learn more about him.

Regards,
KA

Re: Gerrard

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-21 23:26:12Z

There are a number of listings for Isaac GER(R)ARD / ? GIRARD, but so far there is nothing as early as 1585 and no one specifically from Blois, O'leans. It would help if you could post all the biographical knowledge you have on him to prevent redundant and irrelevant searches and postings. Others would know whether to look for him in London, Frankfurt or Virginia.

Regards,
KA

Rev. John Paul Coste

caustin151 — 2009-11-21 23:02:13Z

I am looking for information on Rev.John(Jean)Paul Coste of Montpelier France. He was pastor of the French Huguenot Church in Charleston, S.C. around 1792. I would love to know more about him.

Gerrard

KayeSarrouf — 2009-11-21 21:50:24Z

I'm looking for more information about an Isaac Gerrard who went to England around 1585. He came from ville Blois, O'leans, France

Re: Surnames VUATIEN, VUATIN, VUATINE, WUATIN, VAUTIN or similar

aarmbee — 2009-11-21 10:00:02Z

This information rings a bell. I'll check my sparse records and get back to you.Rosemary

DREWETT variations before 1700

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-21 01:08:07Z

This investigation provides examples of just about every difficulty one could imagine in the process of family research. Not only are there a wide variety of spelling variations, there are also apparent mistranscriptions of relevant data. There are two apparent groups of listings from the LDS archives:
i.) DROUET, DROVET, DROUIT
ii.) DREWET(T), DREWIT(T) and DRUET(T), DRUIT(T) along with DREUITT, DRUIETT, DREWWIT and so on.
However this separation can simply be attributed to a failure in the programming of the soundex files. Certainly within the second group there is a great deal of variability, even within a single family (see: Spencer Drewett and Jane as parents of 11 children at Saint Pancras). The most common cause of spelling change is that the document was written by a different church official (whether that is caused by a new official at the same church or relocation to a different church.)

An examination of Drewett listings in the LDS archives for data from extracted sources in London that is prior to 1700 reveals a number of individuals and families in London proper along with Stepney and other such locations throughout the 1600s, along with a more general distribution at other locations going back to the mid 1500s in Oxford. These listings demonstrate a presence well before the 1685 exodus of French Huguenots, possibly early enough to bypass the Huguenot era completely,

As a potential alternative to the William DROUIT (1750), there is a documented listing for William DREWWIT, bap. 1747 at St. Mary Whitechapel in Stepney. Given the hit or miss nature of the transcribed portion of the LDS archives, a more thorough examination of reference documents would need to begin with the baptism of William Henry (1771).

Interesting, though so far undocumented, and certainly not of any known relevance at this point, are the contributed examples of surnames like De Roet with northern French origins and connections to London in the 1300s. Also Dutch De Ruit may be similar. If strong emphasis is placed on the second syllable, then the first might be consequently diminished. Just a bit of conjecture at this point.

Regards,
KA

Re: COURCHA Bethnal Green 1800's

egorrie53 — 2009-11-20 00:59:10Z

My family name is Field. I have a book noting the name of a Navy frigat that my family may have come from France in. I have a book of accouants from 1763 London, but it has notes in it from 1800 on to at least 1825. There is reference to David Field, James Field, and his father Thomas Field and his wife Jane Field, both of which died 1818 and 1808 respectively, and John Field the father of Thomas. In a birth record for John Field 1820 it shows David Field and Martha Field, weavers. This is how I got to you as David was not that common a name as you would think. They were from Shoreditch, and subsequent generations from Bethnal Green. Can you or anyone shed any light on the Hugonots as it was said that there was some trouble over "religion" in France. From what I have read here, it is beginning to come together, but it would be great if anyone else could shed some light on this. Thanks very much.

DROUET in London - see DREWETT

Korvis_Albion — 2009-11-19 00:46:10Z

I don't know why my initial reply wouldn't post. I did try it a third time and still got nothing.

There are several lines of investigation that may be worth further discussion. Primary of course is the origin of Bartholomew. His marriage in 1739 is referenced, but details are not given. Most importantly, where does the marriage take place? Since this is the first documentation for Bart*, the details of the document are essential.

The introduction of Pierre DROUHET (b. 1697) shows there was a fourth child born to Guillaume and Jeanne and baptized at La Patente on Brown's Lane. The Nov 1705 aid listing also records them living in Spitalfields on Pettycoat Lane, but there were only three children. It is Pierre who would have been 8 years old at the time, and Daniel Guillaume is apparently missing.

Since there are 42 years between the birth of Pierre and the marriage of Bart*, it might be possible for there to have been another generation in between. It is important to establish location in order to discover documentation.

Even though LDS has it labeled as an extracted listing, the birth of William in 1750 shows no reference to a documentary source. Therefore the earliest confirmed and relevant documentary reference so far is the baptism of William Henry in 1771 from the parish registers of St. Botolph Without Aldgate. That, at the very least, leaves some additional data to be presented.

The opposite side of the coin, which seems more probable at the moment, involves a number of LDS listings that can be turned up in London, Middlesex, Surrey and so on using the surname DREWETT. Variations including DRUET, DRUETT, DREWITT, even DROAET. Of note, the 1712 baptism of William DREWITT at St. Botolph Without Aldgate. It may be that DROUET is just another spelling variation within this surname set. At least on a numerical basis, it is much more probable than any hypothetical connection with Guillaume and Jeanne at La Patente, simply based on the fact that the spelling is the same.

Regards,
KA

Re: Tracing DROUET in France > 1772+ England

elaynedrouet — 2009-11-16 18:24:45Z

Hello Linda,
Yes this is my direct descendants branch Alfred b.1815 would be my great great great grandfather. Alfred and Mary Ann Mott had children William b1838, Alfred Charles b1840, Bartholomew Peter b 1842 along with another 5 children. I then branch down the William b1838 line with John Burgess being his son b 1871 but William b1838 had a son William Henry b1865, his son Charles William Burgess b1904, then my dad b1933, then myself b.1959 and my sister born 1968. I am not just concentrating on my direct line I am trying to include every Drouet I can find. If you descend from John Burgiss b.1871 line are you then down the line of his son John Burgess b 1891 or Alfred William b 1901?
Its quite exciting to hear from you. I don't visit Ancestry much these days as I spend my time mainly of findmypast.co.uk so if you would like to keep in touch my email address is: elaynedrouet@hotmail.com
best wishes
Elayne

Re: Tracing DROUET in France > 1772+ England

ldrouetddb — 2009-11-14 13:07:47Z

Elaine,
Was Bartholomew's gg grandson Alfred Charles (b. 1840 d. 1885)?
Linda Drouet

Re: Tracing DROUET in France > 1772+ England

ldrouetddb — 2009-11-14 12:58:57Z

We are Drouets in California, via London, and decendents of Alfred (b. 1815 m. MaryAnn Mott); Alfred Charles (b. 1840); John Burgess Drouet (b. 1871). Is this a branch of your tree?
Linda Drouet

Re: Surname POUT or LE POUTRE

danielpout — 2009-10-27 02:45:37Z

I stumbled across this thread while looking for a link between the Pouts who lived in county Durham in NE England from the end of the end of the 18th century onward and the Pouts in Kent. We have always assumed that somehow we are related but are missing the link. The oldest ancestor we know of in our line is William Pout (1781-1849). He was married to Catherine (1771-1847) and had a son named John who was married in Greatham to Ann Blackett in 1822. Any clues would be appreciated.

Re: CATON: 1600s Essex, ENG

Hollylianne — 2009-10-25 22:42:29Z

Not my direct ancestor no. My Frederick Caton married a Mary Ann. Although there could be a Frederick in my line that married a Rachel. My Catons come from Thaxted in Essex. Do any of yours go from yours? Hollie

Re: CATON: 1600s Essex, ENG

adeleingle1 — 2009-10-25 19:16:42Z

Hi Hollie

was frederick married to rachel?

regards
adele

Re: The Society of Saint Onge (1800s-1900s London, ENG)

kenwill175 — 2009-10-24 08:07:31Z

Hi Tony,

I have also been looking into The Society of Saint Onge. I came into contact with the Secretary about 15 years ago, it is my understanding that the society loaned some of their books to the Huguenot Society. When I first went the Huguenot Library they were not able to locate them. The Society still had some later book and as far as I know they are still functioning as a charity today.

My mother was a Grellier and the root goes back to Peter Paul Grellier c 1740

Ken Willo

Re: Huguenot Origins of PRIOLEAU: early 1800s Derbyshire, ENG

coldor110 — 2009-10-22 16:36:22Z

Thanks for the reply .I know nothing about Elizabeth Prioleau except she married Hugh Hartley and I have all the info on her as a hartley.She did sign her marriage transcript so I assume she was well educated.Any info much appreciated

Dorothy Livesey

Re: Huguenot Origins of PRIOLEAU: early 1800s Derbyshire, ENG

bethelmaria — 2009-10-22 15:14:23Z

My mother is a Prioleau. Her father was Charles Frank from South Carolina, born Charlie Franklin. Dr. Rachelle Prioleau, Clarion University may have some information regarding the history we have from research done in the 1980's. Years sgo, a co worker from France told me it means Before the WAters, I believe.

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

repunzul — 2009-10-18 00:34:39Z

Thank you, Korvis, for your two replies today. Your information gives me plenty to think about and explore. If I find anything new due to my explorations, I will post it to help others. If your or anyone else reading these postings has future suggestions, please post them.

You've been so very helpful, I can't say thank you enough.

Regards,
Debi Coe

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

Korvis_Albion — 2009-10-17 22:09:22Z

Some revisions necessary as he was apparently indentured AFTER arrival in Rhode Island.
http://www.brendabova.com/ribristol/query011.html

BAIRD, NEWCOMB, PINAUD, PINEAU, PINEO, PINNEO, SOULARD, SOULART posted by Lawrence B. Peet on Sunday, July 18, 2004:
"Any information on James PINNEO (Jacques PINEAU) or the Pinneo (PINEO) family will be appreciated: Jacques PINEAU, whose name was soon transformed into PINNEO, came to Bristol about the year 1700, in company with Jean SOULARD. Tradition relates that they fled from persecution in France, landed in Plymouth, Massachusetts; and that being unable to pay their passage across the ocean, they were sold into servitude by the captain for a term of four years. Their conduct was so excellent, however, that they were released after a few months. About the year 1725, they removed from Bristol to Lebanon, Connecticut, where PINEAU left descendants* SOULARD became a resident of the same locality. * James PINNEO had two sons and three daughters. James, the eldest son , born 1708, married Priscilla NEWCOMB, whose son, James was the father of the Reverend Bezaleel PINNEO, for fifty-three years pastor of the First Church in Milford, Connecticut, from 1796 till his death in September 1849. The PINNEO family is an extensive one, and is represented chiefly in New England and the Middle States, and in New Brunswick and Nova Scotia. Several Protestant families of this name fled from France at the period of the Revocation; among them Jeanne and Catherine PINAUD, natives of Cherveux, in Poitou. -- (Archives Nationales, Tr.) One James PINEAU was naturalized in England, January 5, 1688, at the same time with a family named SOULART. (History of the Huguenot Emigration to America, by Charles W. BAIRD. D.D., Volume II, Pages 314, 315, New York, Dodd, Mead & Company, Publishers, Copyright 1885. -- Joliet Public Library Reference Department, Joliet Illinois.) Lawrence B. Peet, (Grandson of Llora May PINNEO)"

Baird can be read on Google Books.
Also an interesting bit in J. W. Porter, "A genealogy of the descendants of Richard Porter…", starting on page 197.

Other references to Jacques Pineau and Jean Soulard in "France and Rhode Island, 1686-1800" by M. E. Loughrey or to Jacques Pineau and John Soulard by the Ontario Genealogical Society may also be of interest and perhaps you can get copies of the relevant pages through an interlibrary loan.

The years from 1688 to 1700 fall neatly in between the two references I cited previously, but you will definitely have to focus your investigation on this period and see what English data there is to be found.

Regards,
KA

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

Korvis_Albion — 2009-10-17 19:53:40Z

My references for the Royal Bounties are only two internet databases. The better is posted by RootsWeb.
http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~frpayments/I...

The other has more limited transcriptions from a few earlier references, but it is good to have the earlier references chime in.
http://cams-atid.ivry.cnrs.fr/refuge-huguenot/english/interr...

PINEAU was the only variation I saw. There is also one SOULARD per, but again it is not the right individual. These data plus the extracted LDS listings provide some interesting information, but seem to contribute nothing to your investigation at present. Access to the possibility of additional relevant data is made difficult by the fact that the primary reference for English Huguenots, the ‘Quarto Series,’ is not available online.

Meanwhile, I suggest you submit your own initial inquiry to the forum regarding this ancestor, with as much detail of date and location as you can provide, particularly about his early life, along with your sources. If he was indentured, who was he indentured to? When and on what ship did they arrive? It may be that your ancestor, as an indentured person, is only recorded in the ship lists (etc.) as “and servant”.

I see there are a few early American documentary references in the RootsWeb Family Trees under PINEO. It may be helpful to join up with the best and most recent of these fellow researchers. There is also the question of what documentation might exist in the English Huguenot archives. After all, he is born in France and married in RI. Ostensibly he leaves no record in the Huguenot churches. He is naturalized – when and where? And potentially he is indentured – when and where? Many persons were indentured and the Huguenot element may have little significance here. Finding and following the family he was indentured to may provide evidence of his presence in England. Beyond that however, I’m not sure what else could be expected. As the connection with SOULARD seems to follow the same path, it may help to research him also.

Regards,
KA

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

repunzul — 2009-10-17 04:57:04Z

Thank you for the extensive response to my inquiry.

I did not know about Royal Bounties - can you guide me as to where to find information about them?

Jacques/James did emigrate from Lyon to London; then came to US as an indentured servant and was released early. He married Dorothy Badcock and settled in Bristol, RI.

As of yet, I do not have anything as to what ship he arrived on nor location of naturalization. He came to the US with his lifelong friend, Jean Soulard, but no other family members. The information I have found states that he and Jean left Lyon together.

Thank you for the information that Huguenot is Calvinist. I am just now getting familiar with this side of the family and any information or directions you can point me in are helpful and appreciated.

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

Korvis_Albion — 2009-10-16 19:01:44Z

With several pages of ‘James Pinneo’ on RootsWeb, I would say he is numerously recorded, but I’m not sure how well. There is only one ‘Pinneaux’ and it’s not Jacques, it’s still James. PINNEAUX is generally rather uncommon, as is PINNEAU. As an outsider, I do not know the limitations of spelling variations that might be relevant to this investigation. Just looking at several references for Huguenots in England however, I find that the variation PINEAU has a number of documented listings in the Huguenot churches of London and in the Royal Bounties. There is also one PINEAUX. Unfortunately no James or Jacques.

Some of the more detailed RootsWeb listings indicate that the emigrant James Pinneo was born in Lyon, France, and married after reaching New England, so possibilities for his documentation in English parish registers would be rather slim and you might do better to look for him in the ship lists rather than the British Huguenot Society. You already have his naturalization. Do you have anything that gives a location? Were other family members naturalized at the same time??

One of the locations in New England that was associated with the RootsWeb investigations is Bristol, RI. This may be of interest if one takes note of the extracted LDS listings for PINEAU from the French Episcopal Church in Bristol, England. The RI town took its name from the English city, but did the settlers also have the same origins? I haven’t pinned that down yet. Also while French Episcopalian is both French and protestant, it isn’t exactly Huguenot, which is Calvinist. I can not speak to the exact extent of the BHS records regarding Episcopalian documentation. A more direct route of access to this data might be considered if this research possibility is of interest to you.

Regards,
KA

Re: RO(U)CHON: 1600s Pinasca, Italy > Pinache, Germany (Waldensian)

chiefroshong — 2009-10-16 15:44:20Z

Linda,

I just came across your post. I am currently trying to research Anna maria Talmon, my 5th great grandmother. She was married to Phillippe Rouchon. See http://www.roshong.org

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

repunzul — 2009-10-16 03:33:35Z

TOny:

My husband's ancestor Jacques Pinneaux is well recorded as being a Huguenot who fled to England about 1683, stayed, naturalized, came to the US and changed is name to James Pinneo. How can I locate the records you speak about in the first paragraph of your post? Are there any individual sites I can go to for these organizations? Any assistance is appreciated.

Thank you,
Debi Coe

Re: PARADINE HUGUENOTS

Korvis_Albion — 2009-10-14 18:45:59Z

You say, “I know my family descended from huguenots I just haven't discovered when yet!” What about where, or perhaps who? Huguenot ancestry is proven by evidence, not by intuition. I’m not going to debate your family history, I’m not looking and you’ve said nothing. Just from the data that I saw previously, there was nothing to indicate a Huguenot connection, but there certainly may be further information in other sources. Given that there is early PARADINE documentation in London, it is always a possibility that your Huguenot connections are on the maternal side rather than the paternal side. With all the various possibilities and complexities, a fully developed family tree is an indispensible part of any genealogical investigation. If you desire assistance from other researchers, then relevant information from your investigation needs to be presented. The best method for this is a family group sheet for your oldest well-known ancestor.

You say, “Still don't understand the 1800 thing though...” Seriously? Well try, try again. When the various groups of refugees came to England (Huguenots, Walloons etc.), they often formed their own communities with their own churches and maintained their own church documents. The movement of these refugees culminated with the revocation of the Edict of Nantes in 1685 and ended in the subsequent decades. The Royal Bounties etc. are a record of the aid these refugees received from the government. Over time these people and their descendants were absorbed into the general population. As a result of the communities dispersing, their churches and other institutions came to a close and the documents they generated also ended. The approximate last date for any document of a ‘Huguenot’ description, as offered by your source, is stated as 1800 – if not earlier. Therefore, stated in a general perspective, all Huguenot documentation ends before 1800, because no Huguenot communities or institutions existed after 1800 to generate any further records after that time. And as a result, it is your responsibility to connect to the documentation provided by the Huguenot society, as they can not use their collection of Huguenot reference data (which is pre 1800) to connect to you - assuming they possess additional data beyond what you have already presented.

Regards,
KA

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

ronmesnard — 2009-10-13 23:19:17Z

Just because your ancestor was French does not mean that they are Huguenot. Huguenots were a small percentage of the population in France. Even if your ancestors were Huguenot in France, unless they are in the Huguenot records that Tony checked it will be an extremely difficult to prove. You will need to find them in the records of a Huguenot church then prove the connection.

Re: PARADINE HUGUENOTS

ClaireParadine — 2009-10-13 19:12:47Z

I know my family descended from huguenots I just haven't discovered when yet!
Still don't understand the 1800 thing though...
c

Re: PARADINE HUGUENOTS

Korvis_Albion — 2009-10-13 16:08:16Z

First of all, do not presume that there is any relationship connecting these data listings simply based on surname similarities. If you want extracted information, LDS shows listings for PARADINE | PARRADINE in the early 1600s in Bedford and Buckingham and a bit later in London. It appears that there are already various family lines at this time. But what matters here is not a bunch of names and dates, it is the relevance to your family ancestry. You must establish that relevance generation to generation. You can’t just pull listings from a hat. Use the census listings and parish register information to establish the when and where of what is known about your oldest generation of ancestors and it’s a go from there. You’ll know Huguenot ancestry when you see it.

As to why 1800, it is, after all, 200 years of genealogy. Obviously someone has to do it and it won’t be them. They have no Huguenot information after 1800, as they say. It is the limit of their database. Just finding a random person in the database with an identical or similar surname simply isn’t good enough, you have to prove that the person actually was one of your ancestors.

Regards,
KA

Re: Mesnards in Charente Maritime

ronmesnard — 2009-10-12 12:11:00Z

I will need to check the LDS out. I haven't done so in over a year. I had always assumed that France distroyed all the church records. The Huguenot war was all about money. After building Versilles, France was broke. Only legitimate children could inherit. The edict of Nantes stated only catholic marriages were legal. However, distroying all records would insure France could never back peddle. In England they were burning Catholic churches with every one inside. That is the ultimate solution. Even in the colonies, British burned all non Anglican churches that they came across and whent out of their way to find.

I can't get too excited other than some Huguenot records do exist. Mesnard is a common name in that region. Not far to the south there was a Mesnard castile. I have heard the ruins are now a resort. I suspect Dan's parents are Andre Mesnard and Miss DuBois.

Re: Mesnards in Charente Maritime

Nelehelbon — 2009-10-12 05:00:49Z

Sorry it wasn't clear to you.
1.Jeanne MESNARD married Andre ROBERT in La Tremblade, 15th November 1654.
2.Pierre MESNARD was Jeanne's brother.
3.Catherine MESNARD was the godmother of Jeanne & Andre's son, also named Andre.

All the above is information I found whilst looking for my ROBERT ancestors in two microfilms from the LDS. "Registres Paroissiaux, 1593-1792 Eglise reformee de La Tremblade (Charente-Maritime)". There may have been more MESNARDS but as I was looking for ROBERT, I did not note down any others.
Hope this is of some help.
Helen

Re: Mesnards in Charente Maritime

ronmesnard — 2009-10-12 01:34:19Z

I am interested but I am not clear on the reference. Do you know his name? How was he related to Jeanne, her brother? Then Jeanne was a Mesnard?

Re: Mesnards in Charente Maritime

Nelehelbon — 2009-10-11 07:57:43Z

Whilst searching the Reform Church records of La Tremblade (very near Marennes) for my ROBERT family, I noted the following references to MESNARD.
Jeanne, wife of Andre Robert, 15 Nov. 1654
Catherine, godmother of Andre Robert (son of the above)
Pierre, brother of Jeanne above. He was Capitaine de Marine and uncle of Jeanne Robert(dau of Jeanne & Andre).
This may be of interest to you.
Helen Noble

Re: D'ERFWHEELER Surname: France > India

kerrygray126 — 2009-10-08 08:46:12Z

hi,ive had the same trouble although ive found some d`erwheelers on ancestry.co.uk im trying to find my husbands real mother.he was adopted.his name was darren james lansdowne d`erfwheeler.he was born in poole-dorset in hampshire and was born on january 4th 1981.i would really love to find her for him.we dont know his mothers name so if you know of anything please could you email me.thank-you.my email address is kerry.gray@rocketmail.com

PARADINE HUGUENOTS

ClaireParadine — 2009-10-05 10:44:37Z

I have been given this info from the society but what do I do now?
I am trying to link my family to Huguenots....obviously...
The Huguenot Society publishes volumes in what we call The Quarto Series, and annual editions of its Proceedings. The former are mainly transcriptions of Huguenot church registers and lists of Huguenot names extracted from other sources. Proceedings contain articles on a wide range of Huguenot topics and people.

These are the references to Paradine :

1 Quarto Series vol 12. The Dutch church in Colchester.
From the register of the Colchester Grammar School, the transcriber extracted names of pupils probably of Dutch descent. Among them he found:
12 Sept 1710, William Paradine, a free scholar and son of William and Sarah. He had been baptised at St James the Greater in Colchester 14 Feb 1700.

2 Quarto Series vol 33, extracts from the records of the Weavers’ Company (in Guildhall Library in London) page 16:
Josias Christian, a Frenchman, admitted 12 Dec 1664. There is then a reference to a Mrs Mary Parradine’s pensioners. Who this lady was, I’ve no idea.

3 Quarto Series vol 13, baptisms register of Threadneedle Street Church in London (the largest Huguenot congregation in the British Isles):
23 June 1678 was baptised James, son of James Paradie and Anne Miohe his wife. Godfather was Andrien (could be Andrew or Adrien), godmother, Dorotez Vanderliegue. Paradie could a misspelling of Paradine.

4 Proceedings vol 2. The index we currently have only gives the name and the volume in which a reference occurs, so it is of little use unless of a well known Huguenot family.

I have been told the following:

"There is no short cut to discovering whether one’s ancestors were Huguenots; it is a patient search back through the standard records to about 1800. Most Huguenot records finish before or about that date. Beware that spelling of names can change over time."

Why back to 1800...this is the bit I find confusing. Anyone???

cx

Five Huguenot lines in Mittelfranken

Richard_Sale — 2009-09-29 18:00:04Z

This part of my ancestral investigation has brought me to the early French-Reformed communities of Mittelfranken in Bavaria. The cities of Erlangen and Schwabach were at that time located in the historical states of Brandenburg-Bayreuth and Brandenburg-Ansbach respectively, and also the village of Wilhelmsdorf, which has a more involved early political history. The town was purchased from the Margrave Christian Ernst of Bayreuth by Sir Isaac Buirette von Oehlefeld, an interesting person of Walloon origins, and in one source the village was listed as part of Bayreuth-Culmbach.

These are the persons representing the five lines of Huguenot ancestry which I am investigating.

1.] Jean SALE
He is first documented in the Wilhelmsdorf French-Reformed Kirchenbuch (FRKB) at his marriage in 1719. Later he is listed as Jean LaSale and Jean Sales at the births of his children. He was a stocking-maker in Wilhelmsdorf and he was buried there very early in 1744. His parents and his origins have not been established. Several years after his death, members of his family moved to Erlangen.

2.] Marie Antoinette AVIÉNY
She was the wife of Jean Sale and is listed in the Wilhelmsdorf FRKB as the mother of their children. She was born in Wilhelmsdorf in 1701 according to the research of Eugen Bellon published in his book, "Scattered to all the Winds (1685-1720):…" Her father, Daniel Aviény, was for over 20 years the first secretary for the second foundation (1694) of a French community in Wilhelmsdorf. His origins were in the village of Abriès in the Queyras valley, up in the mountains of eastern Dauphiné southeast of Grenoble, now in Hautes-Alpes (05) There is some further information on this man and his family from Bellon and other sources.

3.] Sigismond Daniel Eberhard HORNIG
He was married in Erlangen-Neustadt in 1764. He was a church musician in the town of Bruck and is presumed to have then become the organist for the French-Reformed Church of Erlangen. His parents are listed as Jean Daniel Hornig and Sophie Christine Sänger. His wife was Catalene Vielzeuf. At the time of the wedding, his father was a French-Reformed music director in Heilbron and his mother was deceased.
If this family name really has a French origin, it appears at this time to have been completely Germanized. Huguenot listings show surnames such as HORNUS or HORNISSE, but nothing has been established.

4.] Antoine VIELZEUF
He was married in Schwabach in 1719 according to Wilhelm Beuleke’s listings in "Kolonielisten" (from data provided by the German Huguenot Society) and he was the father of Catalene Vielzeuf (1743). His place and date of birth are not known, but he died in Erlangen in 1754 at age 60. His parents were Pierre Vielzeuf and Marguerite Chantelonne from the village of Saint-Maurice-de-Ventalon. The village was located in Gévaudan, according to the German sources, or located in the parish of Saint-Germain-de-Calberte in the Cévennes in other listings. Today it is in Lozère (48). Additional listings are found in Beuleke’s "Die Hugenotten-Kolonien in Franken."

5.] Marie Madeleine FONTANÈS | FONTANEZ
She was the wife of Antoine Vielzeuf and mother of Catalene. She was born in Schwabach in 1701 and her parents were Fleury Fontanès and Madeleine Couton. It is believed that he was from the town of Sommières north of Nîmes in the Languedoc, now Gard (30). She died in Erlangen in 1772. Her data is from the same two Beuleke references. The actual sources remain intangible and somewhat evasive from my perspective.

Much of the early refugee settlement in Erlangen and particularly in Wilhelmsdorf was transitory rather that longer lasting. There was sickness in Erlangen and Georg Schanz has published a list of those departing in 1687/88. The French community founded at Wilhelmsdorf in 1686 failed several years later on and it was the second foundation of 1694 that soon became a major player in the stocking manufacturing industry. The French community in the city of Schwabach was also founded early on, but both of my Schwabach families, though found the city census of 1716, do not appear to be among the founders. Of course there was a situation building up in the south of France that led to the Camisard Revolt c. 1700 indicating a continuing state of unrest.

Much of the data relating to the Huguenot refuges in Mittelfranken thus far has naturally focused on Erlangen and is mostly prior to 1700, with the other part found in the later census listings from Schwabach. My investigations, meanwhile, are outside Erlangen early on and only converge there in the Erlangen FRKB beginning several decades later. (c. 1735 from Schwabach, c. 1750 from Wilhelmsdorf & 1764 in Erlangen-Neustadt) For whatever reasons, the accessibility of data in the second decade (1695-1705) after the revocation is far more limited than it is for the first. And it is during this time closer to 1700 that several groups of refugees who had been in various Swiss cities are said to arrive in the Mittelfranken area, such as the troupe of Anthoine Tholozan in 1699 listed by August Ebrard.

Always interested to compare notes with others involved in similar investigations.

Test:
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Re: FREE Index of Huguenot Cemetery: Nod Hill, Wandsworth (London), ENG

winwill — 2009-09-28 15:19:42Z

Thank you very much. winwill Ontario Canada

Re: FREE Index of Huguenot Cemetery: Nod Hill, Wandsworth (London), ENG

winwill — 2009-09-28 15:19:33Z

Thank you very much. winwill Ontario Canada

Re: Need help where to start Huguenot records in London

barbcanton — 2009-09-28 13:48:53Z

I am very interested in the "Lamont" you found listed in the records. Would you have any further information?

My ancestor "Lamont" was said to have been a Huguenot, but I am having difficulty tracing backwards from Ireland 1880's....but a set of brass candlesticks hand forged in France have continued to be passed from Father to Son.

Re: FREE Index of Huguenot Cemetery: Nod Hill, Wandsworth (London), ENG

jen_fras — 2009-09-28 06:12:12Z

Hello winwill - I have looked at the records again but can't find any other info for you. If I come across anything will post to this site.

Re: FREE Index of Huguenot Cemetery: Nod Hill, Wandsworth (London), ENG

winwill — 2009-09-28 01:19:26Z

Hello,
My Blackbourne ancestors are interred at Mount Nod (Nod Hill). I do have the transcriptions already but am wondering if there is any biographical data about William Blackbourne (born 1717, died 1796), his wife Frances Burbidge (born 1721, died 1788), their daughter Ann Blackbourn (died 1800), son Edward George (died 1787) All are interred at Mount Nod Cemetery.
Any further information will be most welcome. Do you have any suggestions at to how to find the names of the parents of William Blackbourn (born 1717 Wandsworth, Surrey)? I am wondering if indeed he was born there as I have not found any records after years of searching.

Re: Crequi, Markoe - France to West Indies ca 1685

redmond8353 — 2009-09-25 14:42:04Z

KA -

Thank you! Didn't see your reply until today. I don't deny the Huguenot tradition - nor do I support it. I believe the family I am interested in (the Markoes) might have fabricated some of their history as a means of disguising their somewhat curious origins.