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Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

philslim — 2013-05-12 08:52:29Z

Hi just found this, I have also read that the rebels were set free on Martinique.

THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745 37
CHAPTER IV Capture of ship with transported rebels—List and description of them—Their fate.
A MISHAP befell an expedition with 225 rebel prisoners, of whom 75 had engaged as soldiers. Mr. Smith, contractor, thus related it:—‟Cateaton Street, 22nd October 1747.— Sir, The loss of one of my ships with 150 rebels, the Veteran, John Ricky, Master, bound for Antigua, which was taken by the French privateer Paul Mars, and carried into Martinico, and of 75 sent with the East India Expedition which I was providing for, has been some disappointment to me. I have sent his Grace‟s letter to the Governor of Leeward Islands to reclaim them of the French Governor by three different conveyances. I have also sent a list and exact description to my agents in all our colonies in the West Indies that they may be the more easily detected in case they are taken in any homeward-bound Martinico ship. A copy is enclosed for Admiralty lest any should escape to France or Scotland; all the rest are safe arrived at Barbadoes, Jamaica and Virginia. I desire to know when I am to have the care of those who remain at Carlisle, York, Southwark, and elsewhere.‟ In a postscript is added something as to the attempt to find a North-West passage: „The ships we sent out in search of the North-West passage are returned without having completed the discovery, but have brought us a greater probability than ever.‟
A description follows of the 150 rebels which Mr. Smith took at Lincoln, York, and Lancaster prisons in October 1746. The name, age, profession, county, and stature of each, with remarks, were given in every case. Of the 150, fifteen were women, and three of those Camerons from Lochaber. No. 145 was „Barbra Connell, 19, Perthshire,‟ and she was thus described: „Red hair, clever.‟ „No. 143. Margaret Dykes, 22, no occupation, Lithgow‟ (Linlithgow), is singled out for the distinction of being „well-looking.‟ „No. 57. Isabell Hamilton, 50, comes from Musselburgh.‟ Fortunately all of them could sew, spin and knit—useful qualifications for female colonists.
AN EXACT LIST AND DESCRIPTION of 150 Rebel Prisoners ship‟d at Liverpool on board the Veteran—John Ricky, master—for the Leeward Islands; which were taken near Antigua, the 28th June last, by the Diamond Privateer—Paul Marsale, commander—and carried into Martinico, the 30th June 1747.
No.
First
Family Name
Age
Profession
County
Stature ft.
in.
Remarks
1
Robert
Adam
18
Labourer
Stirling
5
1.25
Brown, smooth-faced.
2
William
Bell
46
Weaver
Berwick
5
4
Black curled hair, strong-made.
3
Dougall
Campbell
18
Servant
Lochaber
5
4
Brown complexion, well-made, ruddy.
4
Alexander
Cattanach
17
Miller
Badenoch
5
5
Black, well-made, ruddy, healthy.
5
Dougall
Campbell
18
Servant
Argyle
5
5.25
Brown, well-made, ruddy.
6
Alexander
Campbell
18
Labourer
Inverness
5
4.5
Brown, pock-pitted.
38 THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745
No.
First
Family Name
Age
Profession
County
Stature ft.
in.
Remarks
7
John
Campbell
20
Labourer
Argyle
5
2.25
Brown, swarthy.
8
Alexander
Cameron
19
Labourer
Inverness
5
4
Brown, well-made.
9
William
Dickinson
44
Weaver
Lancashire
5
4
Red hair, thick-set, healthy.
10
Alexander
Davidson
17
Herdsman
Badenoch
5
3.5
Ruddy, slim made.
11
Andrew
Edwards
24
Servant
Angus
5
5.5
Black, well-made, strong.
12
John
Gordon
19
Weaver
Inverness
5
4.5
Black, well-made, strong.
13
Alexander
Goodbrand
30
Carpenter
Bamf
5
6.5
Brown, well-made, strong.
14
John
Grant
40
Labourer
Badenoch
5
4
Black, well-made, strong.
15
Alexander
Grant
25
Carpenter
Aberdeen
5
6
Brown, well-made, lank hair.
16
Joseph
Hinchcliffe
31
Tallow Chandler
York
5
5.5
Black, pock-pitted.
17
John
Johnson
30
Husbandman
Lanarkshire
5
5
Brown, pock-pitted, strong made.
18
David
Joiner
20
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
2
Brown.
19
John
Kennedy
32
Labourer
Perth
5
9
Black, well-made.
20
George
Keith
35
Shoemaker
Aberdeen
5
11.5
Black, well-made.
21
William
McLean
32
Labourer
Inverness
5
3.75
Black, well-set, strong, ruddy.
22
Duncan
McPhearson
36
Labourer
Inverness
5
6.5
Thin, pale, sickly.
28
Angus
McIntosh
26
Labourer
Inverness
5
6.5
Black, very strong made.
24
Peter
McIntosh
34
Labourer
Inverness
5
4.5
Brown, very strong made, long chin.
25
James
McPhearson
22
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
7
Black, lusty, well-made.
26
John
McLeod
25
Labourer
Inverness
5
4.5
Black hair, pale & slender.
27
Duncan
Monrow
19
Labourer
Inverness
5
4
Straight, pale & slender.
28
Alexander
McLeod
18
Labourer
Inverness
5
4.5
Brown, strong, stares.
29
Charles
Morgan
18
Barber
Elgin
5
4
Brown, well-made.
30
John
Murray
30
Weaver
Annandale
5
8
Brown hair, pale.
31
Thomas
Ogden
34
Weaver
Lancashire
5
5
Brown hair, strong made, lusty.
32
Donald
McGillis
18
Labourer
Inverness
5
0
Black, short-neck‟d.
33
Donald
McDonald
19
Labourer
Inverness
5
8.5
Red hair, strong.
34
Allen
McDougall
26
Gardener
Argyle
5
5
Black, strong, well-made, seems sensible.
35
Angus
McDonald
60
Labourer
Argyle
5
4
Black, strong, ill-looking.
36
Daniel
McKee
18
Labourer
Murray
5
2.5
Light hair, fair, well made.
37
Mark
McCormack
16
Labourer
Moydart
5
3.5
Good face, fair, straight.
38
Alexander
Marnock
26
Shoemaker
Aberdeen
5
4.5
Brown, thick set.
39
George
Nieholl
26
Weaver
Aberdeen
5
7
Brown, strong, well made.
40
James
Neilson
26
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
5
Black, swarthy, slender.
41
John
Robertson
19
Labourer
Inverness
5
4
Brown, straight, slender.
42
Daniel
Ross
40
Servant
Ross
5
5
Sandy hair, swarthy, well made.
43
William
Robertson
17
Labourer
Perth
5
5
Brown, well made.
44
John
Stewart
18
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
4.25
Brown, well made, ruddy.
45
John
Smith
21
Goldsmith
Aberdeen
5
4
Brown, well made.
46
William
Sharp
18
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
5.5
Brown, well made, slender.
47
Daniel
McGillis
12
Arisaig
5
6
Brown, well made, stiff.
THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745 39
No.
First
Family Name
Age
Profession
County
Stature ft.
in.
Remarks
48
James
Lacky
16
Weaver
Edinburgh
5
0
Black, straight.
49
George
Bain
25
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
5.5
Black, swarthy.
50
Hector
McGillis
16
Herdsman
Inverness
5
0
Black, lusty.
51
John
Scott
17
Herdsman
Perth
5
3.5
Light hair, fair-fac‟d, slender
52
John
Stewart
18
Labourer
Aberdeen
5
3.5
Brown, well made,swarthy.
53
John
Thompson
18
Labourer
Bamf
5
4.25
Black.
54
Adam
Sutherland
35
Labourer
Sutherland
5
6
Black hair, pale fac‟d, slender.
55
Isabell
Chambers
25
Knitts
Mearnshire
5
7
Black, tall & slender.
56
Eliza
Clavering
22
Sempstress
Bamf
5
0
Brown, thin.
57
Isabell
Hamilton
50
Knitts
Musselburgh
4
7
Brown, little.
58
Mary
Kennedy
20
Sewing, &c.
Glengary
4
7
Brown, full fac‟d, ruddy.
59
Jane
McKenzie
19
Sewing, &c.
Inverness
4
7
Fair hair, pock-pitted, slender.
60
Eliza
McFarlin
30
Sewing, &c.
Perth
5
8.5
Black, lusty, ruddy.
61
Eliza
Robb
35
Knitts
Aberdeen
4
11
Brown, thick.
62
John
Crookshanks
14
Herdsman
Aberdeen
5
0
Fair complexion, healthy.
63
Duncan
McCleish
18
Pedlar
Perthshire
4
11.75
Pale complexion, slender.
64
Alexander
Low
37
Whitesmith
Lancashire
5
5.75
Pock-pitted, ruddy, slender, healthy.
65
James
Dunbar
17
Labourer
Murray
5
0
Dark complexion, well made.
66
Robert
Tom
16
Labourer
Angus
5
1
Black hair, strong, healthy.
67
William
Chapman
32
Pedlar
Aberdeenshire
5
4.5
Pale complexion, healthy.
68
Thomas
Brownhill
22
Labourer
Perthshire
5
6.75
Fair complexion, slender, well made, healthy.
69
Alexander
Brownlee
20
Watchmaker
Edinburgh
5
6
Red hair, slender.
70
John
Topp
16
Carpenter
Bamf
5
3
Brown, slender, healthy.
71
Joseph
Brown
16
Taylor
Bamf
5
6
Dark complexion, well-made, healthy
72
Daniel
Duff
26
Labourer
Perthshire
5
7.5
Cross made, strong, healthy.
73
Robert
Paterson
19
Hosier
Aberdeen
5
5
Slender, well made, healthy.
74
Alexander
Midleton
41
Servant
Edinburgh
5
5.25
Writes well, well looking, healthy.
75
William
Thompson
40
Labourer
Angus
5
3.5
Dark hair, healthy.
76
James
Thompson
21
Labourer
Bamf
5
2.5
Brown, sickly.
77
Robert
Warren
20
Weaver
Aberdeenshire
5
5
Brown, well-made, healthy.
78
James
Urquhart
18
Labourer
Aberdeenshire
5
5.75
Brown complexion, healthy.
79
Andrew
Mill
17
Taylor
Bamfshire
5
7.25
Brown complexion, healthy, slender, thin.
80
Charles
Grant
19
Miller
Inverness
5
7.5
Brown complexion, healthy, robust, well made.
81
James
Ross
20
Carpenter
Edinburgh
5
2.25
Pale hair, sickly.
82
George
Read
30
Labourer
Bamf
5
4.5
Dark visage, strong, healthy.
83
Peter
Summerall
14
Shoemaker
Lothian
5
1.75
Fair hair, slender, straight.
84
James
Mann
20
Baker
Perthshire
5
0
Pale complexion, well made.
85
William
Mills
22
Servant
Aberdeen
5
3
Sandy hair, healthy, Do.
86
Andrew
Langer
40
Weaver
Dublin
5
6.75
Dark complexion, well made, healthy.
87
James
Lawson
22
Labourer
Angus
5
5.5
Well made, slender, healthy.
88
John
Troop
20
Gardener
Stirlingshire
5
8.25
Dark, sickly.
40 THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745
No.
First
Family Name
Age
Profession
County
Stature ft.
in.
Remarks
89
George
Samuel
18
Bookbinder
Edinburgh
5
5
Brown, pale, slender, sickly.
90
James
Donald
20
Taylor
Mearnshire
5
7.5
Brown complexion,well made, sickly.
91
Andrew
Matthew
32
Maltster
Perthshire
5
5
Dark Dcomplexion, sickly
92
Walter
Minnis
18
flaxdresser
Perthshire
5
3
93
James
Lamb
25
Watchmaker
Edinburgh
5
5
Fair, slender, healthy.
94
William
Jackson
19
Labourer
Angus
5
0
Brown, lusty, strong, well made.
95
William
Clapperton
13
Ploughboy
Bamfshire
4
11
96
Donald
McDonald
58
Servant
Edinburgh
5
5
Swarthy, well made.
97
Hugh
McDonald
13
Servant
Arisaig
4
7
Slender, sickly.
98
James
McClean
19
Nailmaker
Stirlingshire
5
0.25
Sandy complexion, healthy.
99
William
Ross.
36
Sailor
Aberdeenshire
5
3.5
Dark hair, ruddy, well set, robust.
100
John
Livesay
17
Cordwainer
Lancashire
5
6
Pale, healthy, well made.
101
Archibald
McPhearson
16
Cowherd
Skye
4
9.5
Thick, pock-pitted.
102
Duncan
Campbell
16
Labourer
Argyleshire
5
0
Dark complexion, straight, healthy.
103
Charles
Halket
20
Labourer
Aberdeenshire
5
9.5
Well made, sprightly.
104
John
Cuningham
32
Labourer
Argyleshire
5
7.5
Black, sturdy, his own hair.
105
John
McKenzie
22
Gentleman
Ross-shire
5
10
Well made, genteel.
106
Hugh
McFee
30
Labourer
Inverness
5
4.75
Lusty, black.
107
John
Chambers
21
Labourer
Perthshire
5
8.75
Dark hair, well made.
108
Daniel
Dingwell
31
Glover
Inverness
5
0.5
Brown, lame.
109
Donald
McDonald
22
Labourer
Inverness
5
6.5
Black hair, lusty.
110
William
Robertson
20
Weaver
Murray
5
3.75
Dark hair, well made,
111
John
Ostler
25
Gentleman
Lincolnshire
5
7.5
Brown hair, genteel.
112
John
Campbell
15
Servant
Argyleshire
4
10
Brown hair, genteel, sprightly.
113
Joseph
McDonald
27
Servant
Murray
114
John
Bouie
14
Servant
Aberdeenshire
5
0
Nut-brown, lively.
115
John
Anderson
18
Gardener
Aberdeenshire
5
2
Dark hair, well made.
116
James
Anderson
25
Taylor
Ross-shire
5
0
Dark hair, pale.
117
William
Coats
55
Labourer
Aberdeenshire
5
3
Dark hair, shot in right shoulder
118
John
McIntosh
16
Fidler
Inverness
5
0.25
Dark hair, sprightly.
119
William
Campbell
21
Weaver
Perthshire
5
6
Fair, thin, writes well, healthy.
120
Duncan
Ore
41
Labourer
Perthshire
5
4.5
Dark hair.
121
Duncan
Ore
14
Weaver
Perthshire
4
8
Brown, sprightly.
122
James
Reed
18
Labourer
Angus-shire
5
6
Brown, lively.
123
James
Henderson
30
Cook
Angus-shire
5
6.5
Brown hair, slender.
124
James
Petre
20
Labourer
Angus-shire
5
4.75
Brown, sprightly.
125
David
Sharrock
19
Weaver
near Preston
5
6.25
Thin.
126
Francis
Brown
27
Husbandman
Lancashire
5
3.25
Light brown hair, thin.
127
Richard
Riding
24
Weaver
near Preston
5
3
Light brown hair, sturdy.
128
Henry
Bibby
22
Weaver
Wigan
5
6.25
Dark hair.
129
Robert
Singleton
17
Weaver
Walton
5
3.5
Light hair.
THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745 41
No.
First
Family Name
Age
Profession
County
Stature ft.
in.
Remarks
130
John
Williamson
17
Labourer
Aberdeenshire
5
3.25
Light brown, thin.
131
Alexander
Campbell
27
Labourer
Argyleshire
5
7.5
Sturdy, brown.
132
George
Hume
30
Writer
Edinburgh
5
7
Black man.
133
John
Mason
18
Barber
Aberdeenshire
5
3.25
Brown hair, well looking.
134
John
Stewart
17
Labourer
Perthshire
5
3.5
Dark hair, lively.
135
Alexander
Robinson
40
Labourer
Perthshire
5
1.75
Dark hair, pale.
136
James
Sharrock
21
Taylor
Preston
5
6
Dark hair, pale.
137
Richard
Leatherbarrow
32
Weaver
Winwick
5
6.75
Chesnut, sturdy.
138
John
Cottam
17
Labourer
Clifton
5
6.5
Sandy hair.
139
Hugh
Johnson
27
Weaver
Walton
5
3
Blind of right eye.
140
Thomas
Bold
21
Labourer
Wigan
5
5.25
Dark hair.
141
Thomas
Charnley
19
Weaver
Walton
5
8
Strong light brown.
142
Richard
Procter
20
Maltster
near Preston
5
5.5
Dark brown, sprightly.
143
Margaret
Dykes
22
Lithgow
5
0
Well-looking.
144
Mary
McKenzie
20
Spin
Lochaber
Lusty,healthy.
145
Barbara
Camell
19
Perthshire
Red-hair,clever.
146
Jane
McIntosh
20
Spin and knit
Inverness
Red-hair,clever.
147
Flora
Cameron
40
Lochaber
Black-hair.
148
Effy
Cameron
28
Spin and knit
Lochaber
Black-hair,swarthy.
149
Anne
Cameron
30
Spin and knit
Lochaber
Little-woman.
150
Margaret
McDonald
23
Spin and knit
Perthshire
Black-hair.
This description was taken by Mr. Smith at Lincoln, York and Lancaster in October 1746.
The list is taken from three different gaols—Lincoln, York, and Lancaster—and it is likely that the first 46 prisoners whose names are all alphabetically arranged would come from Lincoln; the other names from York and Lancaster being inserted without any regard to sequence. Of the 135 men, 18 hailed from Perthshire, 20 from Inverness, 25 from Aberdeen, 19 from England, and 1 from Ireland. As to the trades represented, 55 were labourers, 11 servants, 20 weavers, 4 herdsmen, 2 gentlemen, viz. „No. 105, John M‟Kenzie, 22, Ross-shire, well made, genteel,‟ and No. 111, John Ostler, 20, Lincolns, brown hair, genteel.‟ There was an Edinburgh writer, George Hume, age 30, marked as a „Black man,‟ whose colour would, no doubt, suit the West Indies. One man, No. 104—a labourer—is noted as having „his own hair.‟ A wig was hardly to be expected from one of his class or his age—he was only 32. Then there is a fiddler from Inverness, of but 16 years and 5¼ feet in height, who is happily characterised as „sprightly.‟ The following other occupations were represented: sailor, watchmaker, carpenter, whitesmith, pedlar, tallow-chandler, hosier, maltster, shoemaker, baker, bookbinder, flax-dresser, nailmaker, glover, gardener, cook, tailor, husbandman, ploughboy cowherd, cordwainer, and last but not least, two barbers. No. 92, Walter Minnis, would probably be Walter
42 THE TRANSPORTATIONS IN 1745
Menzies. Five of them were pock-pitted, and not one of them all was six feet in height. As many as sixty were under 20 years of age.
The island of Martinico or Martinique, into which the prisoners were carried, was in French possession, though taken from the French fifteen years later by Admiral Rodney, to whom its Governor-General, De La Touche, capitulated. It was the chief of all the Leeward Islands owned by the French, and was the residence of the ruler of the French settlements in the West Indies. It was quite typical of the other islands in its character and products. Its exports were sugar, cotton, cocoa, aloes, coffee, cassia, etc., and the climate was more adapted to blacks than whites. The island was recently the scene of a terribly disastrous volcanic disturbance, which came suddenly with appalling and devastating destruction to life and property. In 1747 it was a sally-port for French privateers in the West Indian Seas, just as the Island of Bourbon was to French pirates in the Indian Ocean. As the articles of the 1762 capitulation make no reference to the 150 prisoners in course of transportation, it is to be presumed that they had previously quitted the island.
The captured vessel was duly claimed from the French in January 1748, but they peremptorily declined to hand over it or the prisoners to the British Government. They were then asked to include the latter in the next cartel for the exchange of prisoners, and again they refused to enter into any engagement implying the return of the unfortunates to English servitude. What the fate of these prisoners—these twice-taken captives—ultimately was, does not transpire from the official papers. Let us hope they achieved their liberty and return to their native land in happier times.

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

BonnieSamuel81 — 2013-05-02 22:17:42Z

Indeed! good point, but many came anyway...wasn't like they could easily be tracked down in those days.

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

philslim — 2013-05-02 19:48:03Z

Don't think they would have gone to the states as that was still in British hands. The American revolution did not place until 1775

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

BonnieSamuel81 — 2013-05-01 02:34:23Z

Thank you! This is helpful as yet another piece of the puzzle. So one wonders did they go to France...or to the states?

Alfred of Alloway: Fleming, Beattie, Cockburn, Tod, Walker, Gregor, Linn passengers

ivarw — 2013-05-01 02:32:50Z

This ship brought 8 family names from the Edinburgh area of SCT that are connected to my tree to Canada in 1834, can anyone help me find a passenger list or any record of this ship?

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

philslim — 2013-04-30 15:33:57Z

Also found this.

8 May 1747 The Veteran sailed from Liverpool, England, bound for Antigue, St Kitts and Jamaica, with 149 Jacobite prisoners, including 15 women, on board. They were to be settle as indentured slaves. En route a French privateer The Diamant, under Captain Paul Marshal, captured The Veteran and released the prisoners.

28 June The Veteran was captured by a French Privateer, the "Diamond", under command of Paul Marsal "in or about the Latitude of Antgua".

A letter is transcribed in a 1998 Clan MacKenzie listserve posting, source noted as "Colonies C/8a/58, fo 86" (note that the following dates are probably in the Gregorian calender then used by the French government and navy);

Le 14 aout 1747, le gouverneur de Martinique, M. de Caylus, ecrit au ministre, en duplicata, une lettre chiffree (dont la transcription par les bureaux du ministere est donnee en interlignes) :

"J'ai eu l'honneur de vous rendre compte, par ma lettre du 12 juillet dernier par la Hollande [lettre non conservee], qu'un corsaire de cette colonie avait pris un vaisseau sur lequel on avait embarque 160 Ecossais qui devaient, par ordre du roi, etre vendus comme esclaves aux Isles sous le Vent, pour avoir pris les armes contre le prince Edouard. [ I think he meant "pour le prince"? ]

"Deux capitaines, huit autres, tant sergents que soldats, qui etaient de ce nombre, m'ayant demande de passer en France par ces batiments qui sortent sans convoi, je le leur ai permis et je vous en rends compte afin que vous ayez la bonte de donner, a leur arrivee dans les ports, les ordres que vous jugerez convenables.

"Su r les representations qu'ils m'ont faites, j'ai donne des ordres aux capitaines pour les passer comme prisonniers de guerre et je vous ecris ainsi dans la crainte que, cette lettre tombant entre les mains des Anglais, ces malheureux ne fussent reconnus et maltraites."

My translation, with aid and corrections by Françoise Gaudry, a bilingual descendant of Roderick of Achiltibuie (brother of "Keppoch", first cousin of "Ardloch"), is;

On the 14 August, 1747, the Governor of Martinique, M. de Caylus, wrote to the Minister, in duplicate, a letter Encrypted (Whose transcription by the offices of the ministry is given in interlining)

"I had the honour to report to you in my letter of 12 July by the Hollande [letter not kept, likely refers to a ship called "la Hollande", rather than sent through the land of Holland] that a corsaire [privateer] of this colony had taken a vessel which had 160 Scots on board, who by Orders of the King were to have been sold as slaves in the Windward Isles, for having taken up arms for the Prince Edward.

"Two captains and eight others, some of those sergeants, some soldiers, asked me to arrange their passing to France that these batiments [ ships, not necessarily fighters, but with big or medium size tonnage as opposed to small ships ] can go without convoy, I allowed them to do so, and I and I tell you this so that you be kind enough, when they arrive in port, to give such orders as you deem appropriate.

"On the representations made by them to me, I have given orders to the captains to pass as prisoners of war and I thus write to you in the fear that, should this letter fall into the hands of the English, these unfortunates be recognized and mistreated."

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

philslim — 2013-04-29 17:06:34Z

Sorry that's all I have for now, if I find anything else I will post it.

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

BonnieSamuel81 — 2013-04-29 15:03:04Z

And were they sent to France? Any record of the names of the 10 men?

Re: Jacobites transported to Leeward Islands

philslim — 2013-04-29 13:00:33Z

Hi I found this when looking into George Reid, Jacobites of 1715 and 1745, North East Scotland
Reid (or Read) George Born 29thMay 1716 Desford, Banffshire, son of Walter Reid Labourer 5ft 4 5 ins dark visage, strong healthy In Carlisle. Transported from Liverpool to Leeward Islands in Veteran, but the ship was attacked off Antigua by a French privateer from Martinique. The governor of Martinique refused English demands to hand the prisoners back and granted the request of 10 to be sent to France possibly to negotiate for others

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Wuzentmee — 2013-03-30 00:51:39Z

You have been a huge help Brian and I appreciate you very much!
I found a cousin who said our Pollock line came into North Carolina back
in the 1700's so I doubt very seriously now that I will ever find them.
Oh well, sure wasn't from the lack of trying , right?
Thank you again for your kindness and help Brian,
Deb

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

BrianMartin629 — 2013-03-29 23:32:26Z

There was a ship, the ABERCORN, left Londonderry, Ireland for Wilmington with lots of youngsters on it, and others in their twenties - and I have a feeling that this might have been to do with the Potato Famine in Ireland at about that time. I am only guessing because I don't know the true dates of the famine, just that it was around that time.

The ABERCORN had 471 passengers, and among them was a Robert POLK aged 5 and with him a John POLK aged 6.

....However, they arrived 28 May 1840 and I think you were looking for a voyage around 20 years earlier, so that is a drawback. ... I had a look at the first page of the Passenger List, and it seems to be saying that the full name of the ship was the MARCHIONESS of ABERCORN, although it isn't clear to make out.

...If you can't find "UK to Atlantic Ports" on Ancestry, you can get the passenger list by googling "Ancestry - Ships Passenger Lists - UK to Atlantic Ports 1820-1873." When the page comes up, type in surname POLK. Birth: Ireland. Departed: Ireland. Ship ABERCORN. Gender Male. Race: Irish.

I think you have to take into account that there were lots of mis-spellings in those days, and POLK could be POLLOCK.
It probably isn't them but it is the nearest match I could find,

Brian

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Wuzentmee — 2013-03-29 19:10:34Z

Hello Brian,
My Pollock line were in Belfast. From what I was told by a family researcher, is the earliest names ( arriving in the states ) were John and a Robert Pollock.
Have a Happy and Blessed Easter,
Deb

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Wuzentmee — 2013-03-15 16:21:43Z

Thank you anyways Brian.
And you're right, I'm looking for John Pollock .
He came into either Virginia or North Carolina.
I do have him listed in North Carolina.
Thank you for your time and help.
God bless and have a Happy St. Patrick's Day!

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

BrianMartin629 — 2013-03-15 16:16:03Z

You would really need to know when they arrived in USA,
and have some clues as to where they first lived. I did have another look for them, and there was a William Pollock and a John Pollock arrived at Passamaquoddy, Maine - but they arrived 15 years apart from one another, so there is no way of knowing if they were definitely brothers.

Besides, aren't you looking for Pollocks who arrived further south?

Anyway, John Pollock, born abt 1817, arrived at Passamaquoddy, Maine 1834.

And William Pollock, aged 34 born abt 1815, arrived Passamaquoddy, Maine 1849.

When you look at their dates of birth, it does makes you wonder if they could be brothers. But, as you seem to be looking at ships arriving further south, I doubt if they are your ancestors.

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Wuzentmee — 2013-03-15 13:14:36Z

Thank you Brian for taking the time to help me.
I'm mainly looking for the names : William, John, or Jesse Pollock.
They could have sailed from Scotland.
Researchers have them listed as Scots-Irish.
Oh well, thank you anyway, I really do appreciate your taking
the time to try and help.
Have a safe and happy St. Patrick's Day!
Deb

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

BrianMartin629 — 2013-03-15 07:55:44Z

Debra,
Nobody named Pollock on the CATHERINE, but I noticed some going from Ireland to Wilmington, Delaware, and one to Philadelphia. There may be more. What chistian names did yours have? I noticed a Margaret, James, William and a Sarah, all on other ships from Ireland. Were yours from Ireland?

Brian

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Wuzentmee — 2013-03-14 20:08:44Z

May I please ask if there were any Pollocks on the list?
Thank you and God bless,
Debra

Re: Scotland to Quebec, 1848 :MacLeod, McLeod, McIver: Ship "Greenock"

chloe_dog — 2012-12-02 05:15:16Z

Will do!

Bill Thompson - Toronto

Re: Scotland to Quebec, 1848 :MacLeod, McLeod, McIver: Ship "Greenock"

McLeod1745 — 2012-12-02 02:41:27Z

Yes, a passenger list would be great to find. I suspect there's something in the Scotland National Archives, but I haven't investigated that yet. If you ever come across a passenger list or anything else re the Greenock, please post a note on this message board. I'll do likewise. Thanks.

Glen McLeod -- Winnipeg

Re: Scotland to Quebec, 1848 :MacLeod, McLeod, McIver: Ship "Greenock"

chloe_dog — 2012-12-02 00:03:23Z

Thanks - I had already found that article, and found it very useful.But like you - it is the passenger list I would love to find!

Maybe some day.....................

Bill Thompson - Toronto

Re: Scotland to Quebec, 1848 :MacLeod, McLeod, McIver: Ship "Greenock"

McLeod1745 — 2012-12-01 21:59:01Z

I haven't yet found a passenger list or anything else specific, however I did locate a very good article re this voyage: http://www.irss.uoguelph.ca/article/viewFile/710/1025

Let me know if this is helpful.

Re: Scotland to Quebec, 1848 :MacLeod, McLeod, McIver: Ship "Greenock"

chloe_dog — 2012-12-01 20:22:56Z

Did you ever find out anything? My great-greats (Mckay/Sutherland) were probably also aboard, and lost two children enroute

Re: Michael zeick

jd_scheuble — 2012-09-24 12:04:53Z

Did you ever receive information regarding Zeick (Zeig)?
They are my great-grandparents. Appreciate any information.
Much thanks, Jill

Re: Ship "Paria" NZ 1865/66 Bound from Scotland.

Dotdoug07 — 2012-08-15 05:51:40Z

Hi Ian Joll,
I am the grandson of Charles Craig who married an Elizabeth Booth. Their family settled in Christchurch where there are many relatives.
I have a reasonably complete family tree from James Craig on down but am still chasing the Scots side of the family from East Kilbride.

Make contact via my email doug.071@gmail.com to exchange further information

Doug Craig, Nelson

Re: Ship "Paria" NZ 1865/66 Bound from Scotland.

IanJoll — 2012-08-14 12:14:50Z

I am Albet Craig's grandson and have been researching the Craig family for five years and would like to share all my research with you. Contact me ian at thejolls dot com as I would like conformation of what I have deduced

Re: ELIZA JANE RODGERS TURNER

samanthalamborn — 2012-07-26 22:02:14Z

Please contact me at samigyrl2012@gmail.com...Thank you for your info

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

BrianMartin629 — 2012-06-05 21:19:31Z

Another way of getting the ships list for the Catherine is this...

Google: Ancestry, ships passenger lists - UK to Atlantic Ports.

A list comes up. Its the one second from top referring to Atlantic Ports. Click that. When the page comes up, you don't need to bother with a passenger's name...
Fill in...

Arrival:1822. Bridgeport, Fairfield, Connecticut.
Departure: St Andrews, Scotland.
Ship Name: CATHERINE.

Click search, and what comes up is the names of passengers who were on the ship. Click any one of them (make sure it is the right arrival year) The ships list comes up. Simply look for your ancestor. If not there, click next page for ships list.

Hope you get it okay.

Brian

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Limequilla — 2012-06-05 19:12:14Z

If you can't find it, send me an email by clicking my user name and I'll send you the URL. It is in .jpg format and I don't have time to type it out. :)

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

SoCalMarge — 2012-06-05 18:57:35Z

Thanks,
I could not find it yesterday on Ancestry, although I requested ships arriving in 1872 to Bridgeport. I got all kinds of ships arriving in other years. That's what I love about Ancestry - here today gone tomorrow (or just hidden somewhere else). I have learned to save the url for anything I find on Ancestry that I may want to go back to.
Marge

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Limequilla — 2012-06-05 01:23:00Z

It's on Ancestry (the pay site_ and is part of the NARA Archives, so it could be on Fold3, too.

Atlantic Ports Pasenger Lists, 1820-1873 and 1893-1959
District of Fairfield, Connecticut 1822 October Catherine
http://search.ancestry.com/

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

SoCalMarge — 2012-06-05 01:04:36Z

Where did you see the manifest for this ship? I cannot seem to find it anywhere.
Thank you,
SoCalMarge

Re: Alfred of Alloway

zebrabob — 2012-05-29 03:22:24Z

I have a contact over in Scotland, I'll have to get hold of him when I get back with my new info and have him look.

Re: Alfred of Alloway

ivarw — 2012-05-29 03:19:58Z

I am the 2nd great grand nephew of wife of grandson of James Gregor and the 1st great grand nephew of wife of grandson of John Fleming..that's a mouthful, isn't it?:-) 7 years since my post, wow! Anyway, info from that book and a history of Puslinch is where some of my info came from, and a book written by Jessie Beattie also, but it seemed to be a road block trying to get back much further. James' father may have been John, but I can't remember if I confirmed that or not, it's been a while since I looked at that. I have most of the descendants from James and Grizel and his first wife Lilias Eddy. Got a couple generations back on John Fleming and ran into a road block there as well

Re: Alfred of Alloway

zebrabob — 2012-05-29 02:07:02Z

I am the 3rd Great-grandson of James Gregor. I am from Michigan but am currently doing research in Wellington County, Ontario. I today found a transcribed edition of Benjamin Gregor's obituary. In the notes, it talks of a book or story of "A Genealogy of Badenoch Families" by Llewella MacIntyre and Marjorie Clark.

"In 1834 James Gregor and Grizel Drummond and their seven children came to Canada on the 'Alfred of Allloway' with the Beattie, Cockburn, Todd, Walker, McFarlane and Andison families, who settled in Corwhin, Puslinch. Accompanying the (sic) were James Gregor's daughter from his first marriage, Lilias and her three sons by her first marriage to John Fleming: Alexander, James and John Fleming and her second husband, James Linn. Lilias died in 1835 and James and Grizel raised her infant daughter, Lilias Linn and her three Fleming boys. In the summer of 1835, James worked on the grounds of Dundurn Castle in Hamilton and later Victoria Park in Niagara Falls. Following this, they settled on lot 33, rear concession 8, Puslinch (Badenoch area).

Children of James and Grizel Gregor were: James (b. July 6, 1820); Grace (Aug. 6, 1822-Dec. 1916) married Francis Hawkins; Benjamin (b. May 1824); Peter (Aug. 6, 1828-Apr. 28, 1908). His son, Benjamin married Elizabeth Taylor and had 5 children."

Benjamin was my Great-great Grandfather.

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Limequilla — 2012-04-21 19:24:07Z

Yes, you might be right that they were living in Scotland at the time. I'm not sure about the clergy, either. My thought when I first saw it was that it was just a coincidence.

Re: 1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

BrianMartin629 — 2012-04-19 20:55:01Z

I see that there were only about 40 passengers on the ship, and it crossed my mind that those who were of Irish origin were actually already living in Scotland at the time.
...A lot of Irish came over to Scotland, and I notice that third from the top, there is a member of the clergy amongst them. I just wonder what part he played in this voyage. Did he accompany them from Ireland or was he already living in Scotland?

Brian

1822 Ship Catherine St Andrews to Bridgeport, Connecticut with Irish on it

Limequilla — 2012-04-14 08:19:40Z

Why would an Irish family be on a ship that left from St Andrews waaay on the eastern side of Scotland?

There are other ports that would have been surely closer to home? Londonderry, Belfast, Dublin, Galway and Cork.

I am missing something - a stop perhaps in St Andrews (or perhaps a stop in Ireland FROM St Andrews before heading out into open water? What is the most likely scenario, does anybody know or can guess?

Thanks

Re: SS Marie left Glasgow arrived Sault Ste Marie 9-1-1923

jmtce — 2012-04-10 00:27:05Z

Thank you very much. My husband has her citizenship paper which mentions one trip but not the trip leaving and arriving again.

Re: SS Marie left Glasgow arrived Sault Ste Marie 9-1-1923

BrianMartin629 — 2012-04-07 11:36:36Z

Cindy,
I found some other bits and pieces of information which might be interesting to you.

Helen is on the census for 1911 at 2 Wemyss St, Cowdenbeath...
Donald Robertson Head 38
Helen Wife 29 (b 1882)
Helen dau 9 (b abt 1902)
Robert son 8
Agnes dau 7
John son 6
Donald son 4
Maggie dau 2
Jessie dau 6 months

So Helen's parents were Donald Robertson and Helen Gibson, which I think you already know. (Donald Robertson had married Helen Gibson at Edinburgh in 1901).

...I think I saw an item attached to your tree for Helen,(b 1902) which is good proof that the above census is correct. It is the Borders Crossings image. Canada to USA. There are a lot of scribbles and ink on the page hiding some information, but if you look closely you will see that it gives her mother as being: "Helen Gibson, 2 Wemyss St, Cowdenbeath."

There is also an address in Indiana which is hidden by ink... 466? ....? St, Indiana. I think what happened there was that the address she had come from in Scotland was supposed to be given in that column and by mistake the address she was going to was typed in by mistake, and this is why there are so many changes.
Hope this helps,
Brian

Re: SS Marie left Glasgow arrived Sault Ste Marie 9-1-1923

jmtce — 2012-04-07 04:05:11Z

Thank you so much I will have to check this out further.

Re: SS Marie left Glasgow arrived Sault Ste Marie 9-1-1923

BrianMartin629 — 2012-04-06 08:36:03Z

Cindy,
I wonder if you could check this voyage to see if it is her.

Departing Greenock 10th April 1925 for Saint John N.B.
Ship: MONTROYAL
Helen Robertson, 6 Davidsons Close, Cowdenbeath.
Occupation: Cook.
Aged 23.
Country of intended residence USA.

If you know that the address she lived at in Cowdenbeath was the same as the above, then it's her.
...Although she went to St John N.B. her intended destination was USA.
Brian, Glasgow, Scotland
I will have a search for the other voyages but can't promise anything.

SS Marie left Glasgow arrived Sault Ste Marie 9-1-1923

jmtce — 2012-02-14 17:10:19Z

My husband's grandmother left Scotland from Glasgow aboard the SS Marie and arrived in Sault Ste Marie on 9-1-1923. She left USA in November 1924 and came back on April 19, 1925. I do not know what ship she left on or the one she came back on. Her name is Helen Nelson Robertson.
I am looking for any thing on these voyages: manifest, image, etc.
Thanks in Advance
Cindy

Re: Passenger List for City of Brooklyn 1869

veronicamacaulay — 2012-01-12 16:28:45Z

Got it! Thank you so much!

Re: Passenger List for City of Brooklyn 1869

ERhodes1135 — 2012-01-12 13:57:49Z

It is on it's way.

Re: Passenger List for City of Brooklyn 1869

veronicamacaulay — 2012-01-12 02:16:45Z

Thank you! Interestng that it states that he is from the US though.

My email address is veronicamacaulay@gmail.com. Thank you so much!

Re: Passenger List for City of Brooklyn 1869

ERhodes1135 — 2012-01-12 02:06:57Z

Veronica. I find a manifest for the City of Brooklyn which arrived in NYC from Liverpool on 30 Aug 1869. Andrew Maccauley was a 33 year old male. It states that he is from the US. If you want a copy, give me your e-mail address and I will forward it to you. Don

Passenger List for City of Brooklyn 1869

veronicamacaulay — 2012-01-11 04:07:41Z

I'm trying to locate a passenger list for a 1869 voyage of the ship named City of Brooklyn. My ancestor, Andrew Macaulay, came to the US from Scotland in 1869 and I can't seem to locate his immigration anywhere. I have notes that indicate that he may have been on this ship.

Any assistance would be so appreciated. I'm getting rather frustrated with this brick wall and don't know where else to look.

Thanks!

Re: Young Norval from Scotland

Lorna_McCluskey — 2011-12-23 14:59:19Z

Thank you for the link! Didn't realize there were two ships with the same name! :-)

Re: Young Norval from Scotland

mcdonald073 — 2011-12-23 08:42:37Z

Check out this link.

http://www.pro.rcip-chin.gc.ca/bd-dl/nav-ship-eng.jsp?emu=en...

its a ship information data base and there is info on the Young Norval, it owner, etc.

Re: Muirhead family from Scotland to Canada in 1854

mcampbellrn — 2011-12-10 12:29:54Z

I am the granddaughter of one of Peters brothers. I know they came to Ontario and there were 6 more children born and registered in Keene. They came to the US to Tama County Iowa and Peters father Daniel became a naturalized citizen in 1876. Peter married Hattie Gilford Baker in 1889 and had 4 children. He died in 1944 at the age of 90. My mother is named after Jessie Scott. The family tree is on ancestry.com placed by a granddaughter of Peters.