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Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1294440396000
Classification: Query
Surnames: Killman Coulter Johnson Kerr Pew Upper

Is mother Mary a Johnson or a Killman and who is the father of these two children?

Adam Killman SHUGG, 48, farmer, Stamford Welland Co, same, s/o John & Catherine SHUGG, married Susan COULTER, 23, Stoversville, Stamford, d/o JAMES & Mary JOHNSON (sic), witn: Jessie DONALD & James H. ROLES? both of Toronto, 26 Sept 1878.

How do I interpret this? Is Susan's father James Coulter or James Johnson? Is her mother's maiden name Johnson or is this her husband's name or even that of a previous husband or are the names James and John mixed up?

I have seen Susan's name written as Susan Johnson Coulter, but is Johnson her maiden name or an honorific from her mother's previous marriage to an unrelated Johnson?

Likewise Susan's death certificate indicates her parents as JOHN (not James) Coulter and Mary Jane Kilman (Killman).

A second child , Sarah Jane Coulter. Marriage indicates:

John MERRITHEW, 26, farmer, Thorold Twp, same, s/o James & Nancy Jane, married Sarah Jane COULTER, 20, Canada, Thorold Twp, d/o James & Mary, witn - Martin UPPER of Thorold & Fanny SPENCER of Stamford, 29 October 1879 at Thorold Twp

Same problem with names here and on her death certificate it indicates her father as ANDREW Coulter and mother Mary JOHNSON.

The mother Mary Killman, Johnson, Coulter next marries a George Kerr/Carr. Susan Coulter appears in the George's father's household in 1871 with a half-sister, while Sarah is lodging with a Mary Upper (nee Pew) with two of her sons. This Upper family has connections with Johnsons and Killmans.

I'm pretty sure this is all one family as I've found more connections that increase the probability, but I wish to stand corrected if this is not so.

Mike Carr

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1310658887000
Classification: Query
I am interested in learning what happened to this family.

Coulter Family
In the year 1830 Samuel Coulter with his wife Mary Watson, four sons John (Mary Torbit), James (Mary Carney), Joseph (Rachel Shankes), and Hugh (Margaret Jelly, Ellen McLeary, Margaret Clime Thompson) and three daughters, Mary Anne (Mrs. James Finley), Margaret (Mrs. Alexander Watson) and Rose (Mrs. John McConnell), left Netwanwards, County Down, Ireland, to take ship and sail for the New World. They were accompanied over the broad Atlantic by relatives, among them the McLearys, and Finlays. After a treacherous voyage of 16 weeks they sighted America and came up the St. Lawrence River, hugged the shore of Lake Ontario and finally landed in Markham. The courageous mother fell ill on landing, and in a few days passed away.
The family stayed a while in Markham Township, then Hugh heard reports of the rich soil of Simcoe County and its majestic trees. The family landed at De Grassi Point. John went farther north and took up crown land at St. Paul's west of highway 11, on the 12th Concession of Innisfil, where his son John and later grandson William resided. James located in the region of Churchill. Hugh viewed the splendid oaks and pines near De Grassi Point and purchased 100 acres from Henry Padfield, lot 22, Concession 2, Innisfil. Here he brought his wife Margaret Jelly who lived less than a year. Later he married Ellen McLeary who had come from Ireland about the same time as the Coulters. Hugh bought the farm opposite his first which was covered with virgin pine and cedar. Unfortunately, a fire broke out in the marshlands south, and sweeping northward, cleared all before it.
To Hugh and Ellen three sons and three daughters were born. They were doing well and prospering when the mother, while attending her brothers funeral at Arthur caught cold, which resulted in pneumonia and death, leaving her husband with five small children and baby Margaret; a year old.
Later Hugh married Margaret Clime Thompson, formerly a Cherry Creek, widow of Mr. Thompson who was the father of the late Andrew Thompson, Bradford. Two of the children contracted fever and died. Mrs. Coulter did much for her husband and family and helped to build their new home. The timber was practically all grown on the farm, the door frames, window sashes, and panelling of the stairs skillfully done by hand.
Hugh Coulter's home was a sanctuary for bereaved relatives. His sister Margaret Watson died leaving three small sons, Alex, Jim, and Davey. Samuel, Hugh's father, came to spend his remaining days. Shortly after his brother Joseph came to the homestead, later died and was borne to the cemetery with sleigh and oxen. The Watson nephews....Alex went to live with relatives at Painswick; Jim made his home with his uncle Hugh, learned the blacksmithing in Lefroy, and married Sarah Jane, daughter of Mr. Coulter, and at the time of his death was foreman in Snider's foundry, Waterloo. They had two daughter, Eleanor (deceased), and Edith of Lefroy. Both taught school at Waterloo. Davey stayed with his uncle until he went to Manitoba with his bride.
Returning to Hugh Coulter's family....Margaret Clime Thompson Coulter passed away and was buried beside her first husband in Clement's cemetery. Hugh's daughter Mary Ann married Thomas Cook, a native of Liverpool. They first lived in the Hollows, West Gwillimbury, where one little son George died and rests in Zion cemetery. Later they raised four sons, John taking over the farm which was sold recently; Tom who is in the council and a former Reeve; Willima became a skilled physician in the west (now deceased); Herbert of Parry Sound is an engineer on the CNR.
George Coulter, son of Hugh, married Elizabeth Bennett of Gilford, Later, they went to farm west of Aurora. Their children were Nellie, Bertie, Ethel, William, and Harry. Both Mr. and Mrs. Coulter died and Ethel made her home at eht Coulter homestead, and become a school teacher.
Samuel Coulter, eldest son of Hugh, always remained on the farm. He married Mary MacLeod of Alliston. Of their family Grace Ellen married Thornton Reid, Mary Edith (Mrs. T. Stephens), Sarah Margaret (deceased), Mabel Gertrude (Mrs. Charles Stewart), Emma V. (Mrs. W. Ingram), Hugh Alexander (deceased, and John Lorne (deceased).
Hugh Coulter passed away in January 1903. Samuel Coulter in 1927, and Mrs. S. Coulter in 1942. After the passing of Samuel Coulter the old homestead was sold to Sir Edmund Walker estate, De Grassi and now it is the possession of Mr. Harold Walker. For a time before the farm was sold, Mr. and Mrs. Ingram lived there with her mother Mrs. Coulter. Their daughter Kathleen was the fifth generation of the family to live on the place. Mrs. S. Coulter moved to Lefroy with the Ingrams where she lived to her 89th year.
Lilacs, the emblem of hospitality, were brought from Cherry Creek by Mrs. Margaret Clime Coulter, and planted around the homestead yard, as were the French Lilacs.
The Coulters came originally from the north of Scotland and fled to Ireland during a time of persecution. The Coulter crest is a royal crown with inset heart pierced with arrows.
From the Innisfel Township Centennial (1850-1950); A Record of 100 Years of Progress. Historical Review. (pages; 38-39)

Joseph Coulter
JOSEPH COULTER, son of Samuel Coulter and Mary Watson, was born in about 1818 in Netwanwards, County Down, Ireland. He married RACHEL SHANKES (born, abt 1826, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada - died, after 1880, Lawrence, Essex County, Massechusetts), she was the daughter of John Shanks and Elizabeth MNU, on 24 August 1843 in Innisfil, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada (1). Joseph died sometime before 1858, due to Rachel's re-marriage to John Guild/Gould on 23 Feb 1858 (2). Joseph and Rachel had four known children (3).

1) JOHN COULTER, born in about UNKNOWN DATE in 1846 in Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. Date and place of death is UNKNOWN.

2) JAMES COULTER, born 22 Apr 1849, Oro Township, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. He married CHARLOTTE ELIZABETH EMMS (born, 22 Sep 1854, Oro Township, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada - died, 24 Sep 1916, Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada), she was the daughter of John Emms and Martha Ann Jane Partridge, on 5 May 1868, in Oro Township, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. James died on 4 Sep 1926 in Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.

3) ANNE COULTER, born in about UNKNOWN DATE in 1850 in Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. Date and place of death is UNKNOWN.

4) JOSEPH COULTER, born in about UNKNOWN DATE in 1850 in Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. Date and place of death is UNKNOWN.

(1) (Joseph COULTER & Rachel SHANKES, both of Innisfil, blank, on August 24, 1843, by proclamation, wtn: Henry SMYTH & Alexander WATSON, by William Fraser, United Secession Pre(sbyterian) )

(2) (John GUILD, 31, Scotland, Innisfil, s/o James & Agnes (GORDON) GUILD, married Rachel COULTER, 29, Canada, Innisfil, d/o John & Elizabeth SHANKS (sic), witn; James COULTER of Innisfil. 23 Feb, 1858).

(3) (1861 Census of Canada. Family is living in: Essa, Simcoe, Canada West. Their Religion: F. Presbyterian. Household Members were: John Gill; born 1825 - Scotland, Rachel Gill; Born 1826 - N. Canada, John Colter; born 1846 - N. Canada, James; born 1848 - N. Canada, Anne Colter; born 1849-N. Canada, Joseph Colter; born 1850-N.Canada, Charles Gill, born 1858-N.Canada.)

Children of Rachel Shankes Coulter Gould and John Guild/Gould, Coulter half-siblings. five known children;

Joseph and Rachel Shankes Coulter's family

1. When and where did Joseph Coulter's father - Samuel Coulter die?

2. When and where did Joseph Coulter die?
3. When and where did Rachel Shankes Coulter Gould die?
4. When and where did John Coulter die?
5. Did John ever get married?
6. When and where did Anne Coulter die?
7. Did Anne ever get married?
8. When and where did Joseph Coulter die?
9. Did Joseph ever get married?
10. Who is Hannah Coulter in the 1871 Canadian Census living with Rachel Coulter Gould and her new family
In the 1871 Census of Canada. Family is living in; Medonte, North Simcoe, Ontario, Canada. Their religion is Presbyterian. Household Members were: John Guild, age 45; Rachel, age 43; Charles, age 13; Rachel, age 10; Elizabeth, age 7; Susannah, age 4; George, age 2; and a Hannah Coulter, age 19

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1333181508000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1333185524000

My research tells me that Rachel Coulter Shanks & John Guild (her 2nd husband after Joseph's death) are my great-great-great grandparents. Their daughter Rachel Guild married James Manderson. One of their children, Agnes Manderson married Alexander T. Herron (his father Thomas immigrated from Ireland). Their daughter Barbara was my grandmother.

Please let me know if you get this message!

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1333182513000
Classification: Query
Rachel Shanks Coulter Guild (born 1828 in Canada) died in 1893 in Lawrence, Mass.

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1333560251000
Classification: Query
Is there a way to get her death date

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1334425244000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1334425261000
Rachel Coulter Shanks Guild - died 24 Feb 1893, Lawrence, Mass.
Do you have a lead?

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1361690565000
Classification: Query
Surnames: Watson Coulter
Guess I'll start by saying hello cousin.

I descend from the Watson/Coulter line through Alexander Watson. My grandmother was Mary Marguerite Watson dau. of Alexander Watson of Innisfil Ontario. He and his brother James (m. Sarah Coulter) were in the QOR Toronto Battalion during the Finnian Invasion, afterwards he immigrated to Texas where he was a Texas Ranger before marrying and moving to Idaho.

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1361691064000
Classification: Query
Hi Mike,

Tim Taylor here. Susan Coulter is the daughter of James Coulter and Mary Johnson (maiden name, not married name) Coulter. Susan was most likely given the mother's maiden name as her middle name, hence Susan Johnson Coulter. There were several Coulter families all descended and related that had similar names of children so I would be careful when saying that your Susan dau. of James and Mary is the same as the dau. of John and Mary and would suggest looking further. My gr.x2 Uncle, James Watson, married a Sarah Coulter and If I remember correctly she was a dau. of an Andrew Coulter - have to go back and check that part myself.

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1361691453000
Classification: Query
Nope, Uncle Jim married Sarah Jane dau. of his Uncle Hugh Coulter. Alexander Jr., James, and David were sons of Alexander Watson Sr. and Margaret Coulter. Not sure if Alexander Sr. was brother, or nephew, of Mary Watson the mother of Hugh Coulter.

Re: Killman Coulter Johnson of Bertie, Thorold and the Falls

Posted: 1361744411000
Classification: Query

I think we are, indeed, talking about different Coulter families, yours being from the Innisfil region and mine from Bertie township area and Thorold township, both in present day Welland county, Ontario; that the family names are identical is a striking co-incidence, but only that.
The situation I indicated in my first post is certain and doesn't really pertain to the following postings. The only mistake I made there was the name Mary nee Pew should be Mary nee Lampman.
I could agree that there might be some relationship between all these Coulters. Even in Thorold I can see two different Coulter families inter-marrying with the same families mentioned.
To confound the problem a brother of George Kerr mentioned as a possible third husband of Mary Johnson also had a mother-in-law by the name Catharine Coulter, resident in Buffalo,New York.
Thanks alot for the info you supplied. I appreciate all data, even if it only elminates possibilies.

Mike Carr

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