This message consists of data I have collected and my personal opinion of Eliza's maiden name; wife of Valentine Motsinger.
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Valentine Motsinger(01/20/1826-10/04/1898) was born in Davidson County, NC. He married an Eliza Martin(source#6330312) on 10/04/1847 in Davidson County. Valentine is buried at Friedland Moravian Church Cemetery. Several of the children from this union are also buried at Friedland Moravian. I must also note that Valentine and "his" family are the only Motsingers buried in this cemetery and to my knowledge, these Motsingers are the only ones buried in a Moravian Cemetery in NC.
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According to the Friedland Moravian Church records, Eliza is listed as "Elisa" Motsinger(04/10/1831-09/01/1886). Sometimes, the Moravians listed the maiden name of women on the cemetery records and the husband's first name. In this case, however, no surname is listed with Eliza(Elisa). She is buried in row 9, grave 10 of the women's section at Friedland Moravian.
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The following contains data I have collected on Eliza Martins born circa 1821-1848 in North Carolina.
1-Elisa C Martin born 1829 in Surry County, NC; parents-Morgan and Mary Martin.
2-Eliza I Martin born 1821 in Stokes County, NC; married Abraham Martin(spelled Abram).
3-Eliza C Martin born 12/17/1827 in Surry County; parents-Morgan Martin and Mary Brittain(compare this one to #1).
4-Eliza Martin born 1837 in Davidson County; parents-James and Nancy Martin.(this one is interesting)
5-Eliza Martin born 1848 in NC; parents-Benjamin and Nancy Martin.
6-Eliza Martin married Phillip Earp on 10/14/1843 in Stokes County.
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Another interesting fact; there are 3 Martin men buried at Friedland Moravian.
1-Charles Erastus(1884-1963)
2-Emanuel(?-1874)
3-James W(1862-1940)
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There are 4 Martin women buried at Friedland:
1-Bertha L Parnell(1893-1966)wife of C.E.
2-Eliza E Swaim(1852-1948)wife of J.W.
3-Mary Regina(1841-1914)wife of James
4-Rosa Bell(1870-1917)
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Martin children buried ar Friedland Moravian:
1-Nannie(1894-1899)dau. of JW & EE
2-Rosa B(1891-1891)
3-Charles Henry(1935-1935)son of DO & M
4-Emanuel(1874-1874)
5-Boy(1892-1892)son of JW & EF
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Question - Most of the Motsingers are buried at Abbotts Creek Primitive Baptist, Wallburg Baptist or Bethany in Davidson County. Why is Valentine buried at Friedland ??

My Opinion-During Valentine's time, marriages took place near the bride's home, township or county. In this case, Davidson County. During 1847, there were not many Martins living in Davidson,and none associated with Friedland Moravian until 1870. I think that Eliza's maiden name was Weavil(I have this from 2 sources with no proof). The Weavil's were associated with Friedland Moravian circa 1820. Valentine joined the Moravian faith with his new bride, Eliza. Therefore, explaining the burial at Friedland.
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Martin Surnames living in Davidson County, 1850 near the Forsyth/Davidson county line.
1-Alexander Martin(age 34)with his family
2-Mary(32)wife
3-John H(14)son
4-Margaret A(12)dau
5-Susan J(10)dau
6-Barnett M(7)son
7-Caroline L(4)dau
8-Andrew J(2)son
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There is proof somewhere !!!!!!!! We do know that Valentine and Eliza were married and that they both are buried at Friedland Moravian.

Best Of Luck,
Carol

My great grandfather was James William Martin married to Eliza Elizabeth Swaim. They are the ones buried at Friedland Moravian. James William Martin's mother was Martha Emily Motsinger. His father was James also. This information is from my father. Thought it may give an alternative direction for your search.

I appreciate the information. It tracks with what I have. Martha Emily Motsinger was the sister of Valentine, my gg-gf, which is a fairly strong argument for the fact that Valentine's wife was Eliza Martin as indicated by the marriage record, and not Eliza Weavel. To date, I have not been able to find any evidence to support the Eliza Weavel theory. Valentine and Eliza moved from Davidson Co to Forsyth Co shortly after their marriage in 1847, and appear on the same page (#199) with James Martin on the 1850 Census. I believe this James Martin and wife Nancy to be the parents of your James who married Martha Emily Motsinger, although I have not been able to prove that. I also believe there is a strong possibility that the James and Nancy mentioned above are the parents of Eliza; again, no proof. Any further input would be gratefully received.

Eliza Weavil not Martin was her name. Valentine Motsinger
was my grandmother, Shellie Jane Motsinger Shields is
grandfather and Eliza Weavil grandmother. Betty

The marriage bond has been transcribed as MARTIN. If she was really Eliza WEAVIL, is this a mistake in the transcription, or did she have a previous marriage to someone named Martin?

I noticed your posting while searching for James Martin's father, Spencer Martin. James and wife Nancy were the parents of Eliza Martin. I'm pasting in a transcript of a settlement paper from the estate papers folder for James Martin. These papers and his will are available in the NC State Archives in Raleigh. James was married as an old man (72) to the 19 year old Mary Regina Fuller. His marriage license gives Spencer Martin as his father. I can find a Spencer Martin in Rockingham county in 1790 and in loose papers of Rockingham county I can find where he was arrested, tried and hung for horse theft in 1795. My assumption is that he is the father of James but I have never been able to find any information to prove that. Neither have I found any information on the family of Nancy, his first wife who died during the civil war. Do you have any information from your research on either of these two?

THE HEIRS OF JAMES MARTIN OF FORSYTH CO., N.C.
MARY REGINA MARTIN, son WILLIAM Fuller, and daughters, MARTHA ANN MARTIN ALLRED, husband, Lindsay ALLRED, ROSABELLE MARTIN Land

1. ALEXANDER MARTIN - 1/8 share (Dec’d) Names and addresses of descendants not known at time. Whether anyone ever received anything is not known either.(this is my line of descent)
2. MARY MARTIN HEDGECOCK - 1/8 share (Dec’d) Heirs not known.
3. JANE MARTIN HESTER - 1/8 share. Living in North Carolina. Possibly a widow since her husband is not named.
4. MATILDA MARTIN WHICKER - 1/8 share. Husband, Robert 0. Whicker
5. REBECCA MARTIN PITTS - 1/8 share. Husband, Aquilla PITTS
6. ELIZA MARTIN MOTSINGER - 1/8 share (Dec’d). Her share to be divided equally among her 12 children. Three daughters had died.
FRANK MOTSINGER - 1/96 share
ALBERT MOTSINGER - 1/96 share
GRANT MOTSINGER - 1/96 share
GEORGE MOTSINGER - 1/96 share
ANDERSON MOTSINGER - 1/96 share
BETTIE MOTSINGER DISHER - 1/96 share. Husband, Robert DISHER
LOUISE MOTSINGER ROBBINS - 1/96 share. Husband, Elijah ROBBINS
MATILDA MOTSINGER WEAVIL - 1/96 share. Husband, John WEAVIL
JANE MOTSINGER WEAVIL - 1/96 share (Dec’d). Husband, Cicero WEAVIL
HARRISON WEAVIL - 1/96 share.
NANCY MOTSINGER DISHER - 1/96 share (Dec’d). Husband, Fred DISHER
CARRIE DISHER - 1/96 share
DORA MOTSINGER DISHER - 1/96 share (Dec’d). Husband, James DISHER
ISABELLA DISHER - 1/192 share
OSCAR DISHER - 1/192 share
7. MATILDA MARTIN HEGE - 1/8 share (Dec’d). Husband, George HEGE
JOHN HEGE - 1/40 share
SAM HEGE - 1/40 share
AD HEGE - 1/40 share
CAROLINE HEGE - 1/40 share
SARAH ANN HEGE SWAIM - 1/40 share (Dec’d). Husband, Samuel SWAIM
JOHN SWAIM - 1/80 share
ED SWAIM - 1/80 share
8. NANCY MARTIN HOLDER - 1/8 share. Nancy was left a widow very early.
*Note: The statement that Sarah Ann HEGE had married Samuel HEGE was a mistake -- probably the result of mental fatigue brought on by trying to keep all the names and fractions straight. Another mistake , however, was made on the first page. Martha Ann Aldrin is listed, followed by her husband, Lindsay ALLRED. Later, the name is used correctly.

Many thanks - this looks very convincing!

Regarding Nancy's ancestry, I suspect that they are the James MARTIN and Nancy WOODS who married 6 Apr 1811, Rowan Co. NC (which at that time would have included what is now Davidson Co.)

James was born around 1794, so I guess it's possible but I always figured that was too young.

I have been researching the Motsinger family for several years now and was pleased to find a first-time reference to Eliza's eldest daughter Louise marrying Elijah Robbins. I thank you for that data.

I plan to visit Raleigh sometime this spring and I wanted to get the Archive references right. When was James Martin's will probated? I thought that he died around 1871 but there are references in your posting to Eliza being deceased (1886) and to her last child Anderson (1872). Was there another document other than his will that spells out the 12-way split among the Motsinger children?

Thanks again for your posting.

Bill Keiner

you asked,"When was James Martin's will probated?"

People's Press 8/18/1871: Martin, James, Aug. 3 1871, in Forsyth County, at an advanced age.

Will of James Martin Sr. dated 9 Dec 1871, probated 8 Sep 1871
Forsyth Co. S-234 page 65

I thought that Eliza Martin Motsinger died 1 Sep 1886 and is buried at Friedland Moravian Church, Forsyth Co. Since James Martin's will as abstracted by the Forsyth Co. Genealogical Society doesn't refer to her as deceased, nor mention her children, is it possible that the document referred to by Jack Martin is actually a much later settlement of the estate? Jack, do you have a date for this?

Alternatvely, could this death date for Eliza be wrong (I'm relying on the Forsyth Co. cemetery records here), or could this burial be someone else, not Eliza?

The 1880 census shows Valentine and Eliza Motsinger in Forsyth County, household 64 in Abbotts Creek
Valentine Motsinger 54
Eliza 48
George 24
Madora 18
Nancy 10
Grant 13
Anderson 11
Charlie 8

Your message referred to Anderson as her last child, born 1872, whereas the census suggests this is Charlie. And if so, is Anderson the child who appears in the 1870 census as Daniel, age 1 month, born May 1870?

I have a copy of the actual "ending" will of James Martin and his estate. It mentions all of Elizabeth Motsinger's children and the estate was equally divided after some controversy between the intermediate family. Elizabeth did pass on 09/01/1886. I have devoted much of my family research in the Motsinger surname since 1998. I would like the Valentine and Eliza argument set straight once and for all. Eliza's surname was indeed Martin; however, early in my research, I found documentation that led me to believe she was a Weavil. This was believed because of the Moravian influence that I felt led Valentine Motsinger to join the congregation. This has been found to be untrue. Daniel, as you refer to in the will is the next to the youngest child of Eliza and is very sick at the time the final will is proven in open court of Forsyth County. Daniel dies 6 months after the will is fulfilled. The Martin family was very wealthy and, I must say, had very "high standards" for each family member. Eliza did not see justice while living, but her grandchildren and great grand children and great great children still carry on the legacy and the standards still live and are not forgotten.

Valentine and Eliza were a match set. This couple went beyond the boundaries of family and fellow neighbors to bring forth a family of their own. If you are lucky and you find relation to the two, remember only this: Family branches can break when storms arise; winds will blow and throw out the false. The heart will always ring true, if you look hard enough. It's not enough to look for names and dates, if your heart is truly in it. Don't forget the life, it still lives.

Valentine Motsinger=1/20/1826-10/04/1898
Elizabeth Martin Motsinger=04/10/1831-09/01/1886

Elisa Martin Motsinger's sister was Nancy Martin Holder (married Jesse Holder). Nancy died in 1914. Death certificates states father James Martin and Nancy Matthews, both of Guilford County, NC.

Spencer Martin & "Raemy" Freeman were married in Wake County NC, March 28, 1827.

Eliza's sister, Nancy Malinda married Jesse Holder. Nancy died in 1914; death certificates states parents as James Martin and Nancy MATTHEWS both of Guilford County, NC.

Hello from Canada. Do you have a connection to Elizabeth MOTSINGER who married Christian HAMM ? She was d/o Felix MOTSINGER. Christian was bro. to Jacob,jr & Andreas(who came here to NB 1783). I am seeking more info on my HAMM line from NC.

Hi Sylvia

I didn't mean to interrupt a Motsinger inquiry, but aren't you my long lost cousin from Canada? I descend from Charles Berger/Barrier of
Rowan/Davidson County, NC.

Chas was first on record in Rowan Co in 1759....both on a tax list and a militia list. His first wife was Yunes (Eunice) (Deed) and his second wife was Johanna (Will). His daughter Barbara Barrier married an Andrew
Hamm and removed to Nova Scotia.

In the past, I have been in touch with Lorrie Glantz but also another lady from Nova Scotia. I am afraid I can't remember the lady's name from Nova Scotia but she gave me a lot of good information.

bye
Stephanie

Carol, If you are still out there, I would love to talk with you about the James Martin of Forsyth Co. I believe this James is my ggg grandfather via my gg Mary Ann (Martin) Hitchcock. Would it be possible to get a copy of the last will of James Martin? Are you sure Spencer Martin was his father? Any relation to Col. Jack Martin of Rock House? My Martins lived around Walkertown/Martin east of Winston-Salem I believe. My Hitchcocks lived in the Deep River District, Stokes and some are buried in Love's Methodist Church graveyard in Walkertown. My Mary Ann married in Stokes 12 Sept 1837 and went off with her husband, Elisha Hitchcock into the wilds of Western Tennessee. She raised eight children and I believe had a good life. Any information you can share about James Martin and his family would be greatly appreciated. I tryed to email you, but you have changed addresses. Nancy