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Children of John White

Children of John White

Posted: 24 Mar 2010 6:41AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi
Am trying to find out about the children of John White b. Devon 1811, wife Mary Ann Anthony b. Devon 1818. They arrived in Adelaide supposedly on the "Rienzi" in 1852.

The information I have so far regarding their children:
Sarah married T. Sandercock
David married Sarah Dicker
Jeffrey married Eliza Martin
Elizabeth Ann married John Fitzpatrick??
William Anthony married Harriett Clark
Edmund married Adelaide Dicker
John ?????????????????

Would appreciate any information regarding John. Have found many John White's in SA BDM but am not able to ascertain from this source which if any he maybe. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 24 Mar 2010 12:04PM GMT
Classification: Query
I found listings for some of these men in the Biographical Index of South Australians. What is strange is that in David's (m: Sarah Dicker) and John (m: Emma Dicker) it says he arrived in 1849 on the HARRY LORREQUER. Only Jeffrey's says he arrived on the RENZI. I couldn't find a listing for John senior (the father) or William.

BISA is known to have errors and omissions but it might be worth checking passenger lists to see if there is an error here.

WHITE David par: John b: c1849 DEV ENG
d: 4.14.1890 Willamulka SA bd: Kadina SA arr: 1849
HARRY LORREQUER ccc: Farmer res: Farrell Flat,
Condowie, Kadina rel: Meth
m: 1.6.1876 Nth Belalie SA Sarah Ann nee DICKER
par: John and Mary Ann nee BUDGE b: c1850 Tam
O'Shanter SA d: 13.7.1926 ch: Tryphena Pearl SA
(1879-), Ida Edith Sarah PEARCE(1 883-1979), Elliott
Hanson (1884-), Spencer Wm (1885-), Hedley David
Adolph (1887-1941), Rose Helena PEARCE(1887-),
Alma Matilda (1889-), Edith Althea PEARCE(1890-),
Beatrice Ernestine RAMSAY(1891-)

WHITE Jeffrey par: John and Mary Ann nee
ANTHONY b: c1851 DEV ENG d: 6.4.1941 bd: Kadina
SA arr : 1852 RIENZI occ: Agriculturalist, Dairy
Farmer, Councillor res: Hill River, Farrell Flat,
Brinkworth and others
m: 1877 SA Eliza nee MARTIN par: Wm and Anna
Maria b: c1856 SOM ENG d: 15.6.1913 arr: 1848
FORFARSHIRE ch: Edie (m), Olive, Louis, Giles, Edith

WHITE Edmund par: John b: 15.4.1853 SA
d: 25.3.1924 bd: Athelstone SA occ: Farmer
res: White Pk, Belalie, Condowie, Yorke Pen
rel: Meth
m: 17.9.1877 Goodwood SA Adelaide nee DICKER (1868-)
par: John and Mary Ann nee BUDGE b: c1853 Tickera
SA d: 1917 ch: Lionel (1880-), Sydney Harold
(1881-Wwl), Mabel LORENZ, NOTTAGE (1885-1972),
Clarence Victor (1887-1960), Lillian Adelaide
HALLAM, Clem (1895-1971), Stanley

(note- when there is a surname capitalised with no christian name, as in HALLAM and NOTTAGE, this is a married daughter. The surname is her married name)


I also found this John - who married another of the DICKER girls, Emma. Emma is a sister to Adelaide and Sarah. John appears to be a brother to David.

WHITE John par: John b: DEV ENG? d: 1919 Perth
WA an: 1849 HARRY L0RREQUER; dep WA
0cc: Farmer res: White Pk, Belalie, Glenelg rel: Meth
m: 7.12.1871 Nth Adelaide SA Emma nee DICKER
par: John and Mary Ann nee BUDGE
b: bapt.22.6.1845 Yealmpton DEV ENG d: 1919? WA
ch: Adelaide Mary WEEDON(1 873-1966), John
Anthony (1875-), Hedley Edmund (1876-1965), Edith
Emmaline (1877-1877), Emma Matilda (Tilly)
STEWART(18 78-1969), Alice Eliza KELLY(1 880-1954),
Arthur David (1882-1966), Augta Louisa FRASER
(1883-1952), Annie Irinea FREARSO(N18 85-1934)

It appears Sarah married Thomas Sandercock and that Sarah was born in Asprington Devon England.

SANDERCOCK Thomas par: Richd and Eliz nee
STANBURYb: 1.4.1844 Launceston CON ENG
d: 22.8.1916 Gawler SA bd: Willaston SA arr: 1853
CALIFORNIA 0cc: Farmer res: Pinkerton Plains,
Mannanarie, Gawler
m: 3.9.1876 Belalie SA Sarah Anthony nee WHITE
par: John and Mary Ann nee ANTHONY b: 2.6.1847
Asprington DEV ENG d: 18.2.1929 ch: Edmund
(1877-1916), Arthur (1879-1971), Herbt (1881-1917),
Gilbert (1884-1960), Ada May (1886-1966)


I couldn't find a listing for John Fitzpatrick.

Anyway, that's the BISA Listings. I'll check Digger BDM's for the facts.

I found two births registerd to John White and Mary Ann ANTHONY in SA.

Digger - South Australian Births 1842-1906 (c) SAGHS

Surname: WHITE
Given Names: Elizabeth Ann
Date: 1856-05-04
Sex: F
Father: John WHITE
Mother: Mary Ann ANTHONY
Birth Place/Residence: Para Plains
District Code: Yat
Symbol:
Book: 6
Page: 440
Cross Reference:

Surname: WHITE
Given Names: William Anthony
Date: 1860-05-26
Sex: M
Father: John WHITE
Mother: Mary Ann ANTHONY
Birth Place/Residence: Hill River
District Code: Cla
Symbol:
Book: 19
Page: 482
Cross Reference:

Here are the Childrens Marriages

From these we can get approx birth Dates.
John b. c1843 (assuming he is of this family)
Sarah c.1848
David b. c1849
Jeffrey b. c1852
Edmund b. c1853
Elizabeth b 4.5.1856
William Anthony b.26.5.1860

Digger - South Australian Marriages, Registrations 1842-1916

Groom: WHITE
Given names: John
Bride: DICKER
Given names: Emma
Date: 1871-12-07
Groom Age: 28
Status: S
Groom's Father: John WHITE
Bride Age: 26
Status: S
Bride's Father: John DICKER
Place: Wesleyan Church North Adelaide
District: Ade
Symbol:
Book/Page: 89/563
Cross Reference:

Groom: SANDERCOCK
Given names: Thomas
Bride: WHITE
Given names: Sarah Anthony
Date: 1876-09-03
Groom Age: 32
Status: S
Groom's Father: Richard SANDERCOCK
Bride Age: 28
Status: S
Bride's Father: John WHITE
Place: Res of J Miller Belalie
District: Cla
Symbol:
Book/Page: 108/791
Cross Reference:

Groom: WHITE
Given names: David
Bride: DICKER
Given names: Sarah Ann
Date: 1876-06-01
Groom Age: 27
Status: S
Groom's Father: John WHITE
Bride Age: 26
Status: S
Bride's Father: John DICKER
Place: Res of J White Belalie North
District: Cla
Symbol:
Book/Page: 107/766
Cross Reference:

Groom: WHITE
Given names: Jeffrey
Bride: MARTIN
Given names: Eliza
Date: 1877-09-25
Groom Age: 25
Status: S
Groom's Father: John WHITE
Bride Age: 21
Status: S
Bride's Father: William MARTIN
Place: St Mark Church Penwortham
District: Cla
Symbol: A
Book/Page: 112/1026
Cross Reference:

Groom: WHITE
Given names: Edmund
Bride: DICKER
Given names: Adelaide
Date: 1877-09-17
Groom Age: 24
Status: S
Groom's Father: John WHITE
Bride Age: 24
Status: S
Bride's Father: John DICKER
Place: Res of Jno Bagshaw [Yorke Peninsula]
District: Dal
Symbol: A
Book/Page: 112/934
Cross Reference:

Groom: WHITE
Given names: William Anthony
Bride: CLARK
Given names: Harriet
Date: 1886-01-01
Groom Age: 25
Status: S
Groom's Father: John WHITE
Bride Age: 17
Status: S
Bride's Father: Wilson CLARK
Place: BC Manse [Kadina]
District: Dal
Symbol:
Book/Page: 146/74
Cross Reference:


Here is the marriage for Elizabeth White to John Fitzpatrick. The age is seven years off her birth cert though. I couldn't match another Elizabeth White-father John White to the right birth date. It says she was 20 here, she would have been 27 (maybe she lied? It happened - or maybe it's the wrong Elizabeth)

Groom: FITZPATRICK
Given names: John
Bride: WHITE
Given names: Elizabeth A
Date: 1883-06-18
Groom Age: 22
Status: S
Groom's Father: John FITZPATRICK
Bride Age: 20
Status: S
Bride's Father: John WHITE
Place: St Patricks Church Adelaide
District: Ade
Symbol:
Book/Page: 135/1173
Cross Reference:

After finding these marriage records and finding approx birth dates, I realized that Edmund must have been born here. I rechecked the BDM disc and only found this one. Mothers name is listed as Huntley but it could have been a missspelling or misheard name or a bad translation from original records. I think this is your Edmund.

Digger - South Australian Births 1842-1906 (c) SAGHS

Surname: WHITE
Given Names: Edmund
Date: 1853-04-15
Sex: M
Father: John WHITE
Mother: Mary Ann HUNTLEY
Birth Place/Residence: Tam OShanter Belt
District Code: Ade
Symbol:
Book: 4
Page: 141
Cross Reference:



I hope I haven't confused things for you with the question is the differing vessels in BISA. It's a bit of a mystery! Anyway, I hope it helps.

Regards
Cally

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 24 Mar 2010 3:45PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Cally

Thank you so much for all your information and the effort/s that it would have taken. I am so appreciative. I too have found the differing BISA vessels information from you a mystery.

I have the following all appearing on the 1851 England Census:

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 24 Mar 2010 3:51PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Cally

Message seems to have decided to send even though I am still halfway through. Sorry! Again most appreciative of all your efforts.

The England 1851 Census shows John, Mary, Sarah, David and Jeffrey all residing in Devon. Have matched all these to their supposed birthdates etc. so am fairly certain that I have the right family. Just deepens the mystery.

Will now follow up the information you have given me and see what one can uncover.

Many thanks
Dianne

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 25 Mar 2010 10:59AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Dianne
I found the passenger list for the 1849 Harry Lorrequer. It doesn't appear that they were on it. http://www.slsa.sa.gov.au/fh/passengerlists/1849HarryLorrequ...

I found that the Rienzi arrived in Port Adelaide 15.1.1852, departing from Plymouth 15.10.1851 under Captain H Taylor
http://members.iinet.net.au/~perthdps/shipping/mig-sa3.htm#s...

but can't find an actual shipping list.
Regards
Cally

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 26 Mar 2010 4:20AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Cally

The mystery deepens! I too have had no success so far. Have double checked my census information from England and that seems to be correct.

However, I then checked the deaths of John White and his wife Emma Dicker, who were supposed to have both died in Perth in 1919. That both died in the same year is not impossible but did raise questions with me.

After checking for the period of 1900-1965 there were no deaths records at WA BDM for either John or Emma. Have double checked and neither record can be found.

Will continue to try to unravel these mysteries. Why anyone would lie about the vessel they arrived in the colony on still leaves me wondering?

Many thanks for your valuable help so far.

Regards
Dianne

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 26 Mar 2010 12:30PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Dianne

It's not impossible about the deaths. My great grandparents died within a few hours of each other. Both were unwell, my great grandmother died at home and my great grandfather said "Well that's me done", laid down on the bed beside her and promptly died too. (both of old age - in their late 80's) Really strange! It definitely happened though, my Grandmother watched it!

Considering that the information came from BISA, it may not have been that they lied. BISA is known to be mostly correct but it does have errors in it. The strange thing is that there are no White's at all listed on the Harry Lorrequer, it's not like they just mixed up the wrong family, and the boys were too young to have travelled on a different boat than their parents, as sometimes happened with part of the family arriving and getting things ready for the rest of the family.

There are plenty of John White deaths in SA too but it's almost impossible to match them to your John White. It makes it all that more difficult to trace ancestors when they have a fairly common name.

Good luck in your search.
Regards
Cally

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 26 Mar 2010 4:00PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Cally

Thank you so much for all your help.

This particular branch of the family tree is throwing up so many mysteries. As soon as I think that something is solved I seem to uncover more of the unexplained!!!

Another branch on my husband's tree has also provided no end of unsolved mysteries as well!!

Again thanks for your help.
Dianne

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 27 Mar 2010 9:52AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi Dianne

I checked WA records and found marriages for some of the children of JOHN and EMMA that were registered in the Northam district which meant the family lived in country WA and not in Perth.

The BISA records of two deaths in 1919 is quite erroneous.

A John WHITE died in Perth in 1920 and was from Goomalling which is a town near Northam.
JOHN WHITE
Aged (Years) Date of Death Suburb
78 02/09/1920 GOOMALLING

Emma died at Northam
WHITE EMMA Female NORTHAM 187 1928

WA marriages
Surname Given Names Sex Spouse Surname Spouse Given Names Spouse Sex Place of Marriage Registration District Registration Number Registration Year
WHITE EMMA M Female STEWART ALEXANDER R Male NORTHAM 24 1908
WHITE ALICE E Female KELLY WILLIAM Male NORTHAM 7 1910
WHITE ANNIE I Female FREARSON ARCHIBALD R Male NORTHAM 20 1913

Other family deaths that show the family lived at Northam.
WHITE HEDLEY EDMUND Male 89 JOHN EMMA NORTHAM 39 1965
WHITE JOHN A Male NORTHAM 149 1951


Regards
Rhonda

Re: Children of John White

Posted: 27 Mar 2010 9:59AM GMT
Classification: Query
Dianne, missed this one marriage that shows a connection to Goomalling.
WHITE AUGUSTA LOUISA Female FRASER WILLIAM Male GOOMALLING 1965 1904

Rhonda
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