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Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 29 May 2015 10:26AM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Bryan / Gurd / Schatkowski
I am searching for information and records on my Great Grandfather Harry Bryan. Estimated birth year: 1879 - Walkerston, Mackay, Qld.
The only information I have been able to locate so far is that he was employed at Barrie Estate as a laborer. This was listed on the birth record of one of his children to Bessie Elizabeth Louisa Gurd/Schatkowski. He had 4 children to Bessie of which only 1 survived - my grandmother May Mary. The children were: 1912 Blanche and Harry (Twins), 1913 May Mary, 1918 Bessie.
We also believe that he is of aboriginal descent. Any assistance with information would be greatly appreciated. I have not been able to find any birth or death records for Harry and have even emailed CSR mills in Mackay asking if they can help with employment records from 1912 for Barrie Estate, no luck yet.

Re: Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 29 May 2015 1:36PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 29 May 2015 1:49PM GMT
Hi

I have found a marriage on QldBDM for a Bessie Gurd to Frank Schatkowski. Is this Frank your Harry Bryan?

Year Reg#

1897 C2048 Frank Martin Henry Schatkowski Bessie Elizabeth Louisa Gurd

There are 11 children born to Bessie with the father being Schatkowski including Blanche and Harry 1912 and May Mary 1913. The father Schatkowski is listed as both Thomas Martin and Frank Martin Henry.
Blanche and Harry and also a child Doris Bessie (1915) are also listed with the father Harry (Henry) Bryan.

I think Harry Bryan and Frank Martin Henry (Harry??) Schatkowski could be one and the same. The name Harry is often used by those given the name of Henry.

Karin

Re: Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 29 May 2015 2:23PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 29 May 2015 2:26PM GMT
Hi again,

From trees on ancestry it would appear that Frank (francis) Martin Henry Schatkowski was born in Poland or Germany in 1872/1873 and in the Queensland State Archives there is an insolvency file dated 1902. Perhaps after this time he changed his name to Harry Bryan but even so I cannot find a death under either name.

Do you have a marriage certificate for Bessie and "Harry"?? If not it may be worthwhile purchasing the 1897 certificate for Bessie and Frank Schatkowski or check out the ancestry trees if you have a subscription as I saw a marriage cert on one tree.

Frank Schatkowski is also listed on electoral rolls up until 1963 in Qld although this could be Bessie's son born in 1902.

Karin

Re: Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 29 May 2015 4:04PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 29 May 2015 4:08PM GMT
You need to have a look at helen81_1's tree to see what was going on. Lots of certs on there. It is nice to see truthfullness on certs for a change!! Frank and Harry were different men.

Your clue is on young Bessie's death cert in 1918 - the death was certified by A.P. FARRELLY, Aunt, of Mackay. The relationship is to the deceased, so she is the child's Aunt.

I believe this was Alice Phoebe AVENELL who married Thomas Walter FARRELLY in 1908. The relationships are a bit complicated but you can work it out with the BDM online (I haven't really looked much but I don't think the births were all registered) and the newspapers. You need to read this article part way down the second highlighted column - Three weddings in one family....

http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/80278235

George BRYAN's mother was Sophia AVENELL formerly BRYAN nee SACHAN (or something similar). Alice Phoebe was his half sister, mother Sophia and father Henry Arthur AVENELL, and Mary AVENELL was Alice's full sister.

Sophia SACHAN married firstly to Charles BRYAN in 1873, and secondly to Henry Arthur AVENELL in 1894.

I think your Harry is a full brother to George but working out the children is a bit of a mission. Just put BRYAN or AVENELL in the surname box for a birth search and scroll through as the forenames differ a bit on the entries. Sophia may have had a number of children between the death of Charles BRYAN in 1883 and her remarriage in 1894.

This looks like your Harry's death:

1926 C679
Henry BRYAN
Father: Charles BRYAN
Mother: Sophia SACHAN

Henry AVENELL and George Detley BRYAN were the executors of his Will.

http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/168808170

Harry's birth?

1880 C3808
Unnamed (Male)
Father: Charles BRYAN
Mother: Sophie SACHAN

I would be getting Sophia's death cert to get a list of all her children.

Debra

Re: Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 29 May 2015 10:13PM GMT
Classification: Query
Thanks for the info, Debra

I don't have a subscription to Ancestry so I couldn't look properly at trees.

Looks like you've found the info required, good work!

Karin

Re: Harry Bryan - Looking for any and all information.

Posted: 30 May 2015 5:10AM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Bryan
Thanks so much for that insight Debra.

Yes I am certain Frank and Harry are 2 completely different men. I will look through the avenues you suggested here and see if I can make some headway with it. I have purchased a number of records/certificates lately - especially those of Harry and Bessie's children.

I have purchased the record of death C679 to see if it will give any more hints as to if that is him or not. - It shows H. A. Avenell certified in writing and as his stepfather.Parents listed as Charles Bryan & Sohpie Sachau/Sachan. His age though does not quite fit. His death is listed as Jan 1926 age 45 yrs.
The record I have for the twin children of Harry Bryan stated he was 33 in 1912. This is only a 2 year difference but something that makes me not be 100% certain it is the right person. I will be adding this information though as a possibility and alternate information while I look deeper in to it. There are also no children listed, living or deceased.

I will update if I find definite links.

Kind Regards
Helen Price

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