Salem - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Re: Elwell's from 1900 to present...

ER10000 — 2009-11-08 20:21:01Z

Wonderful to hear from you. It was from your own postings that I was able to put things together. We are first cousins many times removed. The line and its details is extensive. I'm not sure this site will allow us that much space. May I suggest you give me your e-mail address. If I understood correctly you are in California. So am I in the LA area. While I await your response, I'll get everything together.

Re: Elwell's from 1900 to present...

travelinfoolim — 2009-11-08 03:15:27Z

Hi! I have some information on My grandmother's side (Ransier), but I don't think to Germany. This is exciting!
Please tell me what you'd like to know, I only know a little as I am trying to find info myself. My name is Roberta Elwell, after my grandmother and I have three sisters and one brother. Where do you fall into the family tree? I am Robert's oldest daughter (he recently passed away in 2007). My aunt Betty (Elizabeth Elwell)is also working on the tree and I know she would love to hear more info also. Write back soon!
How much do you know or need?

Re: Elwell's from 1900 to present...

ER10000 — 2009-11-07 22:26:48Z

You asked for data on the Elwell's. But I wondered if you needed data on the Ransiers? I have Roberta Rancier's line back to Germany before the Revolutionary War.I would also like to obtain the latest data on Roberta's descendants. I look forward to your response.

Re: Dunham-Wilkins 1829 + Alloway

BeverlyCarrBradway — 2009-11-06 20:28:14Z

Candy at Salem Co. Clerk's Office would welcome the Dunham info as she was documenting one of the family homes in Alloway.

Re: Obit Help Needed Please

kathy5783 — 2009-10-28 22:58:50Z

Hi
Seen your old post and would like to trade information. Josiah Megill is my grandfather and my mom his daughter was named after his sister.
Thanks,
Kathy

Re: Humphreys Family Tree

kathy5783 — 2009-10-28 22:17:45Z

Hi
My line is Justena Carey Megill married Charles Raymond Humphrey. My grandfather Josiah Megill is Justena's sister. My mother is Justena Carey Megill. Named for her aunt Justena. This is my line. Would like to trade information.
Thank you,
Kathy

Re: Watson

geneslady — 2009-10-28 02:32:26Z

Helen....
I have in my database George Watson and family - data comes from 1860 and 1880 Census for Alloways Creek, Salem County, NJ:

George Watson, b. 1824
Ellen Watson, b. 1832
Martha R. Watson, b. 1856
Mary E. Watson, b. 1856
Sarah A. Watson, b. 1858
William Mowers Watson, b. Mar 1861
Ella Watson, b. 1869

I have located his farm in the 1876 Salem County Atlas. Looks like he owned 90 acres and it was close to Oakland Station - apparently a RR depot.
I see now where your Flanagin tie comes in.........William M. Watson m. Mary E. Boultinghouse - whose momma was Sarah A. Flanagin, d/o Thomas Flanagin & Sarah Peterson. These two are buried at Sharpstown Methodist Cemetery.

Barbara
in Wilmington, NC

Berrys Chapel

BeverlyCarrBradway — 2009-10-28 00:14:10Z

Do you have dates for either Joshua or Alice Cuff Douglass? Alice, d/o Wm Cuff is on a list of those buried there.

Do you know how Joshua was related to Wm A Douglass (Wife Nancy Valentine) buried there in 1933? I've looked up the death certs of a few known to be buried there but can only do this with known death dates.

The cemetery you refer to is Berry's Chapel. There were two worship structures there in the woods. The current congregation is now on Rt. 49.

Re: Watson

BeverlyCarrBradway — 2009-10-27 23:52:39Z

This is from recent memory. George Watson has a tombstone in the cemetery you mention. Daughter Ella does not. There was a pamphlet made of Ella's murder & it is on file at SCHS. The pamphet was titled "Yorktown Tradgedy" mentions minimal info., as I recall, on Ella's parents but did give some background on them. The old pamplet does include a sketch of Ella. For a donation & payment of copy fees you should be able to request a copy.

Re: Firehock

kmmack — 2009-10-22 16:59:44Z

I have no idea if anyone is still researching this but I found in a Grantor/Grantee index my family dealing with Frederick Firehawk in NYC and wanted to find out who he was.

*Grantor: William Slamm and others, Joseph Slamm and others and Levi D Slamm and Margaret his wife to *Grantee: Frederick Firehawk Lib. 403 Page 556 dated Feb 23, 1840 and recorded Apl. 4, 1840. Also one other from Levi D Slamm and Margaret his wife to Frederick Firehawk Lib. 403 Page 559 - same dates.
*Grantor: Frederick Firehawk to *Grantee: Trustees of Mary Slamm Dated Feb 24, 1840 and recorded Apl 4, 1840 Lib 403 pages 557 & 560.
My guess is the Frederick Firehawk was a lawyer.

Re: SURNAME: HANNAH, RAY, WENTZELL, HAINES

MALTMANZ — 2009-10-13 01:09:59Z

My Rays are:
Zaccheus Ray and Elizabeth Sheets
James and Rebecca S Sanderlin
Clarence Ray and Martha J Ray
Charles Ray and Anna S Ray

Garrison,Van Meter,Bodine,Du Bois,Keen (Salem County)

florencemaree — 2009-10-08 19:58:57Z

Looking for information on Gamaliel Garrison m Christen Keen in 1762 - verification from Craig and Fenwick geneologies. Looking to verify son Jedediah (1769 -1847). Married Hannah or Anna (died 1812,possibly in childbirth),not clear. My line comes thru Jedediah to his son Gamaliel (1803-1871)and wife Sarah Bilderback(1806-1889)who moved to DE in 1838-1842 time frame.

Re: FIRTH, ELIZABETH AND SAMUAL

macchione14 — 2009-10-01 05:51:01Z

Hi,

How about info on Harry & Sarah Firth from Jersey City, NJ, they had a son in about 1897, he married at age 20 to a Julia Daly, any info, thanks, Dee

Re: Where is the "Bartlet River"??

Valerie_Caulfield — 2009-09-30 11:51:26Z

I didn't look closely at the header, so responded first to the Salem list, instead of the board. Sorry this will now go out twice to some folks.

Berkley river for Lord John Berkley was the name Fenwick tried to pin on Oldmans Creek,but it didn't really stick.

In the old deeds you'll find several variations/spellings, but no doubt some problem with old writing from ancient documents.

Also Alderman's Kil or Kilen under Dutch and Swedes. Sometimes spelled Oulde Mans, Auld Mans, etc over time.

I know the Delaware river had a few alternate names, as did Oldmans, so found this site on a google search.

Place Names - Delaware River
Delaware River Lenape-wihittuck. Kit-hanne, Swenska Rivier (Swedish River), Nya Swerige's Elf (New Sweden River), Charles River, Zuydt (Soutir) River, Prince Hendrik's River

http://www.newrivernotes.com/de/deplace.htm

My guess you are looking at the will of Thomas Pedrick, cooper, shows that version of the spelling. But if you check the index in the NJA early will book, you'll see also Berklie or Berkley and a few others slip through that are not indexed, when you follow the various records.

Val

Where is the "Bartlet River"??

capnjohn42 — 2009-09-30 01:13:39Z

Got a Salem Co. will, 1719, of a cooper "of Penns Neck, of Bartlet River" but that name is no longer on contemporary maps. Maybe it was one of the branches of the Salem River??

Can anyone help, please??

Thanks!!

Cap'n John

PS You can reply directly if you wish to
capnjohn AT salsgiver DOT com

1803 Deed Charles Newbold of Burlington to Ezekiel Peterson

Valerie_Caulfield — 2009-09-24 17:13:32Z

Deed Book E p. 257
4 Feb 1803 Charles Newbold of Springfield Twp, Burlington County, NJ to Ezekiel Peterson. A parcel of meadow ground in Mannington Twp, Salem County, NJ.

Begins at Slapes old line ditch,

Then S55* W 9 ch 60 lx to line of Benjamin Lippincott's lot.

Then N34*45"W 32 rods to middle of Salem Creek.

Then 48 rods up creek to Upper line ditch.

Then N34*E along Job Shreeve's line
11 acres more or less
Consideration $293.33
Which Newbold had by deed from Job Shreeve and Elizabeth h/w dated 12 Nov 1798 for a larger tract of meadow. (see Lib A, p. 543, 544 and 545.)

Wit: Furman Mulford and Elijah Cattel
Ack. Thomas Sinnickson 4 Feb 1803
Recv'd 4 Feb
and Rec. 25 Feb 1803,
Clement Acton, Clerk

1798 Deed John Kincaid of Phila. to Patrick McCormick of UAC

Valerie_Caulfield — 2009-09-24 16:51:28Z

Deed Book E p. 158
Salem county , NJ

John Kincaid, merchant of Philadelphia, PA and Eleanor h/w to Patrick McCormick of Upper Alloways Creek, Salem county, a tract in Upper Alloways Creek,Salem County, New Jersey

Described as starting at a post in the road from Thompson's Bridge (Alloway), and Swedes Bridge, corner of lands sold by Kincaid to William Morrison and a corner to land sold this day to John Greenfield, borders land sold this day to John Mouers, line of John Holmes, Esq, bounding land sold this day to John Horn.

11 acres and 55 perches, all part of a larger tract Kincaid purchased from George Hitchner and wife 19 Oct 1795, who had bought same of Aaron Thompson and wife 9 June 1795.

Signed and Sealed John and Eleanor Kincaid
Wit: James Wright and Henry Nimmo (?)
(I question the name but what I got from what I could see on the record vnc)

Ack: 13 March 1798

Rec'vd 13 Dec 1801
Rec. 11 Jan 1801 Clement Acton, Clk

*Note the difference in dates, a 3 year delay between the acknowledgment, which might have been nearer the actual date of sale, and the record made in the courthouse. Possible this was brought in on date of a further sale to someone else, to make good the chain of title, but I only took it for the Wright and McCormick mentions. Cross references to other names mentioned in same deed book might give further information. vnc

1802 Deed, UPN. Josiah Biddle and wife to Poltis Risnar

Valerie_Caulfield — 2009-09-24 04:17:35Z

Salem County Courthouse, Clerk's Records
Deed Book D p. 298

Josiah Biddle of UPN and Lacedonia his wife, to Poltis Risnar

19 Jan 1802

Consideration L80 gold and silver for a lot of ground in UPN.

Beginning at a stake in line of Elihu Pedrick and Aquilla Jone's line.

Then S52 and 1/2*W , bounding on same 9 chains and 50 links to a corner.

Then by same S 51and 1/2*E 19 chains and 60 links to a stake.

Then N 52*6' 2 chains 75 links to a stake.

Then N 37*W 19 chains to the beginning. Containing 9 and 1/2 acres and 10 perches of land and swamp more or less.

Signed and Sealed by Josiah X Biddle and Lecednonia X Biddle, their marks.

Witnesses. William Biddle and Edward Bilderback.

Acknowledged 18 Jan 1802
Recorded 21 June 1802, Clement Acton, recorder.

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

jiggilypuffs — 2009-09-17 07:01:19Z

David Harris who married Mary Ewing died 26 Oct 1770. So he couldn't be the father of this David Harris.

His son David Harris Jr. was born 19 Nov 1765 and married Rhoda Terry. Additional proof is that Mary Ewing married Jonathan Diament after David's death and Jr's first son was Jonathan Diament Harris.

-andrea
www.ifinddeadpeople.com

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

jiggilypuffs — 2009-09-17 06:58:13Z

Dilks isn't one of mine, but thanks for thinking of me :)

-andrea

www.ifinddeadpeople.com

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

jiggilypuffs — 2009-09-10 22:45:07Z

Woo hoo! thanks for sharing!! Now to figure out who his first wife was.. and if her daughter's biological maiden name was Harris :)

-andrea
www.ifinddeadpeople.com

Re: Elwell's from 1900 to present...

jiggilypuffs — 2009-08-04 06:44:43Z

William H/A Elwell was born abt 1862 in Massachusetts. His father was born in ME and mom in MA according to 1910 census. He married Gladys Howison (b. abt 1875 Wyoming) about 1909. She was previously married to Mr. Eckert and had children Phil and Fred.

She had daughter Mary M. Elwell in California about 6 months old in 1910. She had Herbert Grant on 29 Jul 1912 in California. She had divorced William Elwell by 1920.

Good luck and perhaps your Elwells will find their way to the NJ Elwells :)

-andrea
www.ifinddeadpeople.com

(I have no idea who Edith is)

1910 United States Federal Census
about William H Elwell
Name: William H Elwell
Age in 1910: 48
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1862
Birthplace: Massachusetts
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Maine
Mother's Birth Place: Massachusetts
Spouse's Name: Gladys
Home in 1910: Township 2, Fresno, California
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
William H Elwell 48
Gladys Elwell 35
Fredrick Elwell 8 [really Eckert]
Philip S Elwell 6 [really Eckert]
Mary M Elwell 2/12
Edith M Elwell 9

Re: Vanaman Coleman

jiggilypuffs — 2009-08-01 23:22:15Z

Etta Vanaman, daughter of James B. Vanaman and Edith High, married Alfred Coleman, son of Julius Coleman and Harriet Smith, on 17 Oct 1898 in Vineland, NJ.

(Sorry, my last post was meant for the other Vanneman posting)

-andrea
www.ifinddeadpeople.com

Re: Van Eman/Vaniman Family

jiggilypuffs — 2009-08-01 23:10:37Z

(to another poster) Cassius C. Wright and his parents Calvin and Roxanna were all born in NY. Cassius died in Philadelphia on 24 Feb 1893 (not 1892) and is buried in Swedesboro, NJ.

John W. Vanneman's death certificate says he was born in Swedesboro, NJ. He died in Philadelphia on 12 Sept 1891 and no parents were listed. He is also buried in Swedesboro.

-andrea
www.ifinddeadpeople.com

Casperson Ruth

JReese386 — 2009-08-31 12:18:53Z

Looking for information on Ruth Bender
Casperson B.1905 d? born in Cumberland county, PA. Husband Norman b.1902 d 1967 Normans Father is Horace Casperson and Mother Ida Jane Newkirk from Salem NJ. Also sons Norman JR,and Richard and daughter Ida Jane Duffy. Looking for death date and interment for Ruth Bender Casperson. any information would be most appreciated,Thank You. Joyce

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-10 22:37:46Z

Putting it all together...

Wills of David and his wife Deborah:

Not Dated. David Harris. Sons to take two shares and daus. one share of landed estate. Moveable estate to widow after debts are paid. To Elizabeth Harris, my first wife's dau., 67 cents and no more. Exec. wife, Deborah Harris and David Cook. Wit. Samuel Brick, Henry Mongar, and Beulah Draper. proved Apr 21, 1812
1. H. Stanley Craig, Salem County Wills, Vol 1 & 2 recorded in the Office of the Surrogate at Salem, New Jersey : 1831-1860., Craig, H. Stanley,. Merchantville, N.J.. H.S. Craig. 1984. b-28 salem county wills page 49

1. H. Stanley Craig, Salem County Wills, Vol 1 & 2 recorded in the Office of the Surrogate at Salem, New Jersey : 1831-1860., Craig, H. Stanley,. Merchantville, N.J.. H.S. Craig. 1984., b-135, proved 3/11/1814, Ancestry.com, www.ancestry.com.
1814, Feb 27. HARRIS, DEBORAH, Upper Alloways Creek.
To dau. Mary Sheets, house and lot I now live on and household goods. To dau. Esther Harris, household goods. To 3 youngest children, Abel, Ruth, and David, remainder of estate. Exec. uncle David Cook. Wit. Enoch Gibbs, Rachel Goller and Aaron Harris.
Proved Mar 11, 1814. B-135.

As listed in Deborah's will...
** ENOCH GIBBS is the husband of HEPZIBAH HARRIS, who is the daughter of JOHN HARRIS and ESTHER BALLINGER.
** DAVID HARRIS is the son of JOHN HARRIS and RUTH TEST. Ruth died in Aug 1774 when David was 12. His father remarried in Dec 1775 to ESTHER BALLINGER. Hepzibah Harris Gibbs was their first daughter.
** AARON HARRIS is also son of JOHN HARRIS and ESTHER BALLINGER

David Haris's 2nd wife was Deborah Cook, daughter of Eldad Cook and Deborah Bowen.
David and Deborah had issue:
Mary (m: George Sheets)
Esther
Abel
Ruth
David Harris (b: about 1806, m: Mary Ann Ernest)

WooHoo! After so many years of researching this, I finally made the connections!

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-11 17:23:57Z

Hey Andrea! good to hear from you again. Check this out! I just got 2 books with lots of pictures in them (borrowed)

one called FOND REFLECTIONS and the other is HOW DEAR TO MY HEART. Isn't Dilks one of your family names or was that Timmy's

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-17 19:24:57Z

Hiya connie - good to hear from you!

I just don't know what to think!!!
I have documentation from Charles through David and Deborah, and in Deborah's will it lists a brother of David and a brother in law of David as executors.
I spoke with Jean and asked if anyone in the family was fooling around and she had no idea whether or not that was going on. I just find this really strange!

Can you see the logic in that previous post? I wish I were there to do some ground work.

Sara

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-19 11:55:59Z

Oh, I know what you mean about tearing the pages out of the family bible! I was interviewing a distant cousin and she had one of the old family bibles and said there were pages missing. Low and behold, my father sends me 70 lb box of pictires and 8mm home movies and guess what I found!!! the pages she was talking about that were missing from that bible. What luck!!! My great grandmother must have given them to my grandmother.

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-18 08:11:58Z

Glad you planted your tires here in Jax on a more permanent basis. Hope to meet you some day :)

In speaking with Jean, she said there are some nephews who are male Harris's, but says they would not likely do the test - said they are hillbilly's in the swamps... LOL. I will work on her to at least get a message to them to ask and beg if it requires it.

She did say her brother may not have done the test right. After all - he did have to re-take it, so, with so many markers off into space... he's either done it wrong or someone was foolin' around... or maybe someone in the line may have taken in someone's kid as their own ???

Anyway, I'm going to hope for a more solid corroboration of my findings... I do have this other little tidbit that is a corroboration - placing David's (1808) father to be of the same name as he, and in David's will mentioning Deborah Harris, and David Cook - and also in Deborah's will mentioning uncle David Cook and Enoch Gibbs and Aaron Harris. It would be nice to figure out who Rachel Goller is - haven't found anything yet.

Well - sleepy time has come - gonna run for now TTYL L)
Sara

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

Oh_Mama_Mia — 2009-09-18 07:49:14Z

Hello CW - it's ok buddy - get a grip! we all had to in figuring out all of this Harris side- an we all still have questions without answers :( There are so many with the same names - especially Thomas, William, Nathaniel, David, Abraham, John and so on that are all born around the same times and places. You really have to dig well and pay very close attention to detail just as Connie made her explanations. I wish you the best of luck in your line.

The funny thing is I an a descendant of Thomas Harris, who is the brother to William Nathaniel, and the research I have been working on is for my cousin - of whom I make a suspicious connection to John, son of William Nathaniel and his son David.

Best of luck with your digs - it's fun!
Sara

Re: old newspapers

DebbieDilksOrner — 2009-08-10 23:36:46Z

What "tragic accident are you speaking of in Salem about 20 years ago? Are you speaking in Salem County or the city of Salem it self? I was born and raised in Pennsville, Salem County and have realatives all over the county. I have had quit a few tragic accidents in my branches. I use to have the paper sent to me but got to expensive on my budget. Perhaps I may have a copy of the accident that you are speaking of.

Re: old newspapers

DonnaC_Walters — 2009-08-11 04:29:42Z

There was a family of five killed in front of the Inspection Station in Sept. of 1986. They were stopped to turn into the inspection station and someone rear ended them and pushed them head on into oncoming traffic. Mother, Father and three children all killed.

George and Mary Biddle to Aaron Biddle 1797 UPN

Valerie_Caulfield — 2009-09-23 23:35:21Z

Book E Deeds
Salem County, NJ
p. 241

George Biddle of UPN, yeoman and Mary h/w to Aaron Biddle, yeoman 17 May 1797. L15 current money in hand paid.

Lot in UPN
Begnning at stake for a corner on main Road that leads from Charles Dolbow's landing to Scull Town,

Thence along said road, bounding on lands of aforesaid grantor N 54* & 1/2 W 26 perches to a stake for a corner.

. Then bounding on George Biddle's land S 34* W 9 perch to a stake for a corner.

Then bounding still on George Biddle's lands S 54 & 1/2* E 28 Perches and 12 links to a small maple marked for a corner.

Then bounding on Joseph Allen's land N 15* & 30' E 10 perches to beginning. Containing 1 & 1/2 acres more or less.

Signed and Sealed
George Biddle
Mary (X) Biddle, her mark
Wit:Joseph Allen
John Dolbow

Appeared 1 Jan 1803 Mary Garrison, late Mary Biddle, before the Judges of the Court of Common Please, Ack: Wm. Biddle

Also appeared witness Joseph Allen who ack.

rec'd 2 Feb 1803 and rec. 19 Feb 1803, Clement Acton, Recorder

Kilsons and Sheppards in 1900s Salem County

adriennewhaley — 2009-09-05 03:08:14Z

I am looking for any information regarding the Kilson and Sheppard families in Salem City and Mannington Township in the 1900s.

The Kilson family included parents Samuel (Waymon) and Bertha Elizabeth, and children Carl, Samuel, Eleanor and (Bertha) Elizabeth, aka Lib.

Samuel and Rose Anne (nee Allen) Sheppard, and their daughter Katherine, were related to the Kilsons - Katherine was Eleanor's cousin, but I don't know which parents are the link.

I have basic, but sporadic, info on both families and am hoping others researching Salem, NJ in the 1900s have come across one of more of these names. If so, please reach out - Thanks!

James Harvey Ancestry

morr8200 — 2009-07-28 14:45:01Z

Searching for ancestry of James Harvey born 1783 in Salem. Marriage #1 Elenda Noble 1804. Marriage #2, Sarah unknown. Died 1860 in Mannington Township. Children: Benjamin, Martha, Elizabeth, Jonathon, Ruth, Abigail, Ann, Phebe.

Re: Vannemans of New Jersey

pkmatthias — 2009-08-01 16:41:33Z

My great-great grandmother was also Anna T. Vanneman. I am trying to uncover ancestors beyong Anna's parents, John and Catherine. Any help here would be appreciated. I would also be very interested to have an opportunity to phtoograph the Vanneman Family Bible.

Many Thanks,
Paul Matthias
pkmatthias@cox.net

Elwell's from 1900 to present...

travelinfoolim — 2009-08-04 04:59:11Z

Hey there!
I was told I could ask about information on this site for Elwell's. My father was named Robert Samuel Elwell, his father was Grant Herbert (or Herbert Grant)Elwell. My father's mother was Roberta Ransier Elwell and she had 3 children, Elizabeth, William and Robert. Later, Grant remarried and had Ronald. We have a book that dates back from the 1600's up to about 1800's, but nothing that connects us up to today. No one in my family can seem to find out anything about Grant's family line. I don't even know what state they came from before CA. Our side lives in California. We have info on the Ransier/Eikenberry line from central California (Fresno area) if anyone needs that
My father's brother William had 5 children and lived mostly in the LA basin (Diamond Bar, etc.). Elizabeth had one son and now lives in Orange, CA.
Any info would be great!

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

genesailor1 — 2009-09-17 14:59:55Z

David who married Mary Ewing is my family and is included in Group 26 .
The oldest known ancestor is Thomas Harris (of Long Island) who died in 1697 in Connecticut. The probate of his estate named three sons and one daughter. The three sons were found in Salem County/Cumberland County and were
listed on a 1715 muster

This David b. abt 1808 is not related based on DNA testing (kit 34495) and is still in the unmatched Harris Y-DNA Project Results.

David HARRIS d.Bef 21 Apr 1812-,Salem,NJ
+Deborah COOK b.Abt 1775-of Upper Alloways Creek,Salem,NJ;m.22 Sep
1800;d.Bef 11 Mar 1814-of Mannington,Salem,NJ
David Harris born about 1807 in Salem County, NJ d. Bef 1880
+Mary Ann ERNEST b.Abt 1808-of,Salem,NJ;m.1 Oct 1829;d.Bef 1900-,Salem,NJ
Josiah Smith Harris b. 20 Mar 1838 in Salem County, NJ d. bef 1910 Salem,
NJ
+Sarah E. TAYLOR b.Abt 1842-NJ;m.24 Sep 1861;d.Bef Apr
1900-Quinton,Salem,NJ
Smith Harris born 12 Jan 1865 in Upper Alloways Creek Twp,Salem,NJ;d.1916
+Elizabeth BROWN b.Feb 1869-Of,Salem,Salem,NJ;m.Abt 1889;d.1933
Wilbert C. Harris b. 20 Mar 1890 in Quinton, Salem NJ, d. Jan 1967 in
Salem, Salem, NJ
+Erma BELL b.Feb 1894-NJ;m.Abt 1911;d.Abt 1956-Salem,Salem,NJ
Millard J. Harris b. 30 Mar 1918 in Quinton,Salem, NJ, d. 1988 Bridgeton,
Cumberland, NJ
+sp: Flora May STREMMEY
.

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

genesailor1 — 2009-09-18 12:34:15Z

Good Morning Sara.

And I thought I was the only one that spent half the night awake :-)

I met the cousin that matched Dad's DNA. He descends from the Rev. John Harris, David's older brother, who trained in Maryland and lived, worked and died in South Carolina. We spent an interesting day being shown around the area and enjoying his family's company.

Is your email still with comcast? We really do need to finally meet.

Have a terrific day! Connie

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

genesailor1 — 2009-09-18 12:19:06Z

Good Morning, Pat.

Oops! It is Elizabeth Hills not Mills. Sometimes my fingers and my brain are on two different planets :-)

DNA testing can be very fustrating. A 12 marker test is not adequate and I always try to encourage a tester to do at least 25 markers. It does give the haplogroup which is extremely important. This David Harris is in the R1b1 haplogroup and my David Harris lineage is in R1b1b2 (a subset) but on the 25 marker test, they only matched on 16 markers. That is why Sara is concerned that the tester either did not do the test correctly or there is a different paternal relationship in his lineage.

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

genesailor1 — 2009-09-18 02:09:15Z

Hey, Sara!

Where are you now? I lost touch. We bought a house in Jacksonville but still RV.

This David Harris b. abt 1808 -- maybe we should try to find another male Harris to do a DNA test. He may not have done the test correctly or it could rule out any other relationships. It does seem odd that this family isn't related being so close in the same area. But they could have come from Pennslyvania. It just seems odd that the kit has not match any others. Of course it took forever for Dad's kit to match and then to find it was from one of Nathaniel's other sons was pretty wild!

Keep in touch. Connie

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

genesailor1 — 2009-09-18 01:17:50Z

Hi, Pat. I have been researching my Harris lineage for over 25 years and I believe I can clear up a couple of things.

William "Nathaniel" Harris was married twice. First to Mariam Brooks in about 1715 and they had 4 daughters. She died in Feb 1722 and he married Elizabeth Harris (believed to be her maiden name) in 1722 and they had 6 sons and 2 daughters. Their son David who was a twin to Jonathan married Mary Ewing and died in 1770 leaving 3 children. Mary then married Jonathan Diament.

Nathaniel's family:
This is the Bible record of Nathaniel Harris shown exactly as it is written in the Bible, his Bible is at the Vineyard Genealogy Society library according to Wayne? who provided this information.

Nathaniel Harris, b. Oct 8, 1693, d. Nov. 2 1775

M 1st Miriam Brook She b. Aug. 16, 1698, d. Feb 13, 1722

M 2nd Elizabeth

Children of Nathaniel and Miriam Harris

Mary, b. June 12, 1716 m. Samuel More (see More family)

Miriam b. Feb 20, 1717 (171 7/8)

Abigail b. March 16, 1720 m Alderman

Elizabeth b. Jan 16, 1721 (1721/2) m Clifton ? Bowen

Children of Nathaniel and Elizabeth Harris

Nathaniel b. May 27, 1723 D. Dec 3, 1797 M. Abigail Padgett

John b. Sept 29, 1725 wife Ruth ?

David, b. April 29, 1727

Johathan b. April 29, 1727

Noah b. July 16, 1729, d. 1777

Josiah b. Nov. 16, 1732

Ruth, b. June 10 1734

Hannah Harris, b. Sept 1738

Nathaniel's will abstract that is a bit confusing:
Will of Nathaniel Harris ---- 27 Jun 1770, of Hopewell, Cumberland County, New Jersey. Yeoman; will of. Son Nathaniel, 10 shillings; sons John, Jonathan, and Noah 10 shillings (first wife children) Son Josiah - Plantation where I live and my salt marsh in Greenwich; to grandson Ebenezer Harris - my lands which I bought of Edward Bullen and since of the NJ Society, except 20 acres at the north end which I give to my grandson David Harris, son of David Harris. My son David's widow shall enjoy the said lands while she remains my son's widow. To my daughter Hannah Ewing and daughter Ruth Whitticar (Whitaker?) 10 shillings (may be 10 pounds) each. To Abigail Alderman and Elizabeth Bowen each 5 shillings. Witness - John Wethern (Worthington) Maskell Ewing, Thomas Ewing, Jr. Proved 14 Nov 1775 - 8 Nov 1777, Inventory 196-6-7. Inventory done by Jacob Moore and Constant Peck. June 1777. Acct by John Buck and Mary Harris Executors of Noah Harris, deceased, who was executors of Nathaniel Harris.

David is said to have died without a Will on 20 Oct 1770 but Nathaniel's Will would indicate that he died before June 1770. Maybe that is the date it was presented to the court.

Now as far as Thomas Harris, the father of Wm. Nathaniel(and Thomas, Samuel and Mary). He was married to Ruth James. He died prior to 5 June 1697 when his estate was probated and listed his children and their ages. Based on that information, he CAN NOT be the son of Daniel or David Harris and Mary Weld and grandson of Thomas Harris and Elizabeth Mills. Daniel Harris wrote his will in 1700 and mentioned a son Thomas. If he was Thomas' father, his will would have named Thomas as deceased and probably named at least his sons. I have tried to correct this Internet misinformation several times. In one case the woman just changed Thomas' death date of 1697 to 1700.

Thomas' parentage has been the subject of numerous genealogy magazine articles over the years. The latest addresses the possible fathers and Daniel was definitely ruled out.

Hope this makes sense of the information "out there." I welcome any male Harris descendant from Daniel and Mary Weld Harris to participate in a DNA test to disprove me!

Connie Harris Bradshaw

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

ChekWriter — 2009-09-18 23:45:02Z

Yes, I see these names on various data bases, and for some do not have any chidlren for the HARRIS - WELD marriage.

And for Elizabeth HILLS, some do not have any parent for her.

That is the problem I have been having, have not come across any wills or estate packages, that tells enough who belongs to who, on my family line.

So just have to keep plodding along and hope for another break through, down the line.

I do see these families also posted on the LDS Web site, famiysearch.org by many inputers, with very old dates, 1969 etc. Research back then what it was, . . . . .

Not every one had or has access to family bibles, like the one cited on previous postings. I know our family bible, and its fly page, etc, went missing many years ago by a very well meaning relative. He just wanted to have them.

A razor blade did the number while no one was looking. Then in the many years hence, it just shredded away into tiny pieces, as he carried it in his wallet. I know well, what happens to pieces of paper anything in a man's wallet.
Body heat, perspiration, etc.

Pat
cw

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

ChekWriter — 2009-09-18 23:09:28Z

Just noticed that the HARRIS - GIBBS - GALLAGHER - BOROUGH/BORROUGH families are listed with Gloucester co NJ references as well.

Maybe there might be some thing in those county records that might shed some light on the difference of the 2 HARRIS lines, since they do not match up on DNA testing.

Just a suggestion.

pat
cw
Still trying to find who was Nancy HARRIS or HARRISON parents, she married Elias MILLS.

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

ChekWriter — 2009-09-18 20:02:11Z

Thank you. That clears up those questions I had.

You put Elizabeth MILLS, it was HILLS/HILLES according to what is posted on rts wb and family search.org web site.

I will fix up my files.

It just came about because I saw that the EWING - FITHIAN - GARRISON - READING - BEATTY, etc families relate to my MILLS as well, of Smithtown, LI NY and Jamaica, LI NY.

Just wanted to link them on the one RTS WB MILLS data base I have been compiling over time.

Thank you again.

It is great now that we have the DNA testing, and again, of course, if the sample was taken correctly, it also helps a lot too.

Have found 5 other branches of my family MILLS, with exact matches on the 12 marker test. And up to a 1 distance on the 37 marker test.

HARRIS is one of the surnames that apparently matches to that of my brother's DNA test on the 12 marker test.

So I guess there is an ancestor that both of our lines share.

pat
cw

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

ChekWriter — 2009-09-17 19:01:55Z

Very Good. Thank you for listing them for me.

Did notice earlier today, that parts and parcel of this family are on www.rootsweb.ancestry.com but not all together. Dates and names slightly off, but basically the same.

Says that David and Mary EWING are son of Nathaniel HARRIS and Elizabeth, on one file, and on others is son of Nathaniel and Miriam BROOKS. So guess need to put your heads together on them.

Nathaniel son of Thomas and Ruth JAMES. Thomas son of David HARRIS and Mary WELD, son of Thomas HARRIS and Elizabeth HILLS, daughter of George HILLS/HILLES.

But if you say, the DNA testing does not match up, then this information is now incorrect.

Also noticed that David and Hannah are brother and sister, and both married EWING children. David to Mary
and Hannah to Joshua. At least that is what some have posted "out There".

Its a little bit confusing as one puts that the one spouse of David's had 8 children. and the other spouse had 4 daughters. But that is not what is listed on their family pages.

That is why I was inquiring. Just wished to kind of get them straight as they might be, at least on my MISC MILLS files.

Did note that David and Mary EWING HARRIS are on 43 data bases on www.rootsweb.ancestry.com.

Pat
cw

Re: David Harris b: abt 1808

ChekWriter — 2009-09-12 00:48:52Z

Was he son of David HARRIS and Mary EWING B: ca 1725 of Cumberland NJ ???
I seem to have this couple on my MISC MILLS file.

cw
HARRIS seems to be a surname that match up via DNA testing, on 12 marker compared to my MILLS family descendant.

EWING - MILLS - FITHIAN - etc seem to be related also via marriages.

Re: Van Eman/Vaniman Family

ChekWriter — 2009-08-01 22:26:51Z

You all pretty much know, am sure, that Salem County became part of Cumberland County, NJ.

Might try also looking at those families related.

Pat
cw
John W is on the 1880 census with the WRIGHT family in Philadelphia, PA. Happened to notice.

Re: Van Eman/Vaniman Family

ChekWriter — 2009-08-01 23:18:38Z

John W's birth year might be in question.
on 1880 census says he is age 70. living with Cassius WRIGHT family in Philadelphia, PA.

on 1870 census says he is age 58
on 1860 census says he is age 48
on 1850 census says he is age 50
on 1840 census NO John W VANNEMAN But there is a
Helms and a
William in Gloucester Co. NJ.

Both have a son 20 and under 30
There is also a lot of VANNEMAN's listed all born ca 1805 to 1816 on 1850 census.

There are also many VANNEMAN's listed in the Upper Penns Neck area.

Does this help at all??

Pat
cw